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Main Programming Event Lines We're changing how this works this year.

#31 User is offline   SeikoMiwarui 

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Posted 19 April 2011 - 07:11 AM

xD Haha, I know. I was just throwing it out there for something to think about and consider! But thanks, at least, for the reassurance! I'm sure things will work well enough that if some problems come along, people are quick enough on the ad-lib. We are con-goers after all. Ad-libbing is something we do quite well XD!

#32 User is offline   S1NN3R 

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Posted 20 April 2011 - 04:07 AM

View PostTheRabbi, on 15 March 2011 - 09:36 AM, said:

So the main points that I'm seeing people say are this:

I don't want people next to me in the line smoking. I don't want people near the revolving doors smoking.
We will tell people in the line not to smoke. The people near the revolving doors will be asked to move further towards the main entrance to the hotel, where they are supposed to be anyway. That should be far enough away.


On the smoking in line issue...

As troubling as it may seem to us, Acen doesn't have any authority in the matter (unless they make arrangements with the Hyatt). According to sections 20 A&B, 30, and 55, the Hyatt would have to take full responsibility. This would also extend their liability and open themselves up for prosecution. Sadly, I don't see this happening any time soon. It also states (section 55) that "No individual may be discriminated against in any manner because of the exercise of any rights afforded by this Act." Simply put, if Acen trys to enforce it, they themselves, will be breaking the law.

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#33 User is offline   DarkMimi 

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Posted 20 April 2011 - 06:29 AM

View PostS1NN3R, on 20 April 2011 - 04:07 AM, said:

On the smoking in line issue...

As troubling as it may seem to us, Acen doesn't have any authority in the matter (unless they make arrangements with the Hyatt). According to sections 20 A&B, 30, and 55, the Hyatt would have to take full responsibility. This would also extend their liability and open themselves up for prosecution. Sadly, I don't see this happening any time soon. It also states (section 55) that "No individual may be discriminated against in any manner because of the exercise of any rights afforded by this Act." Simply put, if Acen trys to enforce it, they themselves, will be breaking the law.

Full act can be found >>HERE<<



So... we would HAVE to put up with people's tobacco addiction while standing in line together? Last year, I was lucky to be grouped next to some people who put away their cigs when they clearly saw my eyes turning red and the extreme coughing from the smoke they were blowing in my direction. There should be something that ACen can do about the problem, like not allow smokers in the line itself because it IS a health hazard. If they want to smoke, then they should be willing to take their precious pack of cigs to the smoking area so it doesn't cause problems for other people.

BTW, I'm sorry if it sounded like a rant .__. I just hate smokers. I was tempted to get out of the Soap Bubble line and go back to my hotel last year because of it. I know you're just trying to help. Stupid act making it a lost cause...

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#34 User is offline   Stormy-chan 

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Posted 20 April 2011 - 01:20 PM

Smoking in outdoor areas is not prohibited. However, the law does prohibit smoking within fifteen (15) feet of all entrances, windows that open, and ventilation intakes.

This is the only restriction they seem to have on out-door smoking, unfortunately. :thumbdown: I totally agree though with smokers needing to take their habit out of the line. They have a right to smoke, sure fine, but I have the right then to breath the air with out the smoke then. We all have rights if everyone would just respect us non-smokers that dont smoke things would be so much easier.... sigh.

#35 User is offline   JawdyBawdy 

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 12:56 AM

first, hooray for moving the smoking area! i don't know what can be done about the smokers in the line being told not to smoke.. but, if a guaranteed return to their spot in line with their friends is a bribe for them to leave the line, can that happen? or could asthmatics who absolutely cannot be around smokers get some kind of.. priority entrance when they get up to those doors where the smokers are? i'm one of those asthmatics that can't even breathe when around smoke, even with my emergency inhaler (that is always on my person). rude people who smoke won't stop when asked and it'd be nice if the small person (i'm so short and nonthreatening) could get some kind of help. breathing is a really nice thing and i'd love to not spend half of the night puffing on my inhaler and with a shirt wrapped around my face to prevent smoke.

second, i really have hope for this new line rule. my group was planning to go to the hotel to get ready for the rave three hours prior just so we could get in without spending half the night around the other side of the hyatt for a fourth year. fingers crossed!

third, though this is nearly impossible, i wish there was more... guarding of lines? i don't exactly know the word to use... but, last year, the line was enjoyable. my group made friends with the people around us and such and we got to know them. then, we turn around, and the people who were originally in front of us are seven people up and we're next to men that weren't in line before then. we politely, then rudely, told them that they should go to the back of the line (endless as it was). of course, they refused. we then told an irt about it and they said there was nothing they could do.. which makes sense since we really had no proof that the very large and scary men did cut in the line... so, i'm sort of just complaining about something that can't be fixed. /shot.

This post has been edited by JawdyBawdy: 21 April 2011 - 05:58 AM

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#36 User is offline   TheRabbi 

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 09:22 AM

On the smoking in line issue:
It's not discrimination for us to prevent people entry to our events on the basis of smoking. Discrimination only comes into things like hiring practices and arrests. As a private event, we get to make our own rules, as long as they stay within the law, which this policy does. If there is someone smoking in the line who has repeatedly been told not to, we will handle that situation in the same way that we would handle any other rules infraction, as that's exactly what it is. That issue is closed.

On looking for line-budging:
We will emphasize this as something that needs to be looked out for by those patrolling the lines. Thanks for your feedback, JawdyBawdy.
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#37 User is offline   JawdyBawdy 

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Posted 21 April 2011 - 05:45 PM

View PostTheRabbi, on 21 April 2011 - 09:22 AM, said:

On looking for line-budging:
We will emphasize this as something that needs to be looked out for by those patrolling the lines. Thanks for your feedback, JawdyBawdy.


thank you, rabbi. i know much of this is just based on the fact some people are rude, which is out of staffs' hands xD

This post has been edited by JawdyBawdy: 22 April 2011 - 03:00 AM

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#38 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 12:45 PM

Question. I'm gonna be a "special needs" person, so... For clarification, we DON'T get into lines for stuff like the concert? Where do we wait?

If I want a decent seat, am I better off getting in the regular line? I know it says we're let in first, but I'm just checking.

What about for panels? I'm totally new to Acen, so I know nothing about...anything.

This post has been edited by Kokoro: 23 April 2011 - 12:48 PM

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#39 User is offline   Smokey 

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 03:41 PM

View PostKokoro, on 23 April 2011 - 12:45 PM, said:

Question. I'm gonna be a "special needs" person, so... For clarification, we DON'T get into lines for stuff like the concert? Where do we wait?

If I want a decent seat, am I better off getting in the regular line? I know it says we're let in first, but I'm just checking.

What about for panels? I'm totally new to Acen, so I know nothing about...anything.



Depending on the severity of your condition, yes. We can get you around the lines if needed. Stop by either of our locations when you arrive and we'll fill you in on everything you'll need to know. We're right at the entrance to Registration in the convention center, and near the front entrances to the Hyatt, next to the Customer Service counter.
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#40 User is offline   KungPowKirby 

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 04:18 PM

View PostTheRabbi, on 13 March 2011 - 04:30 PM, said:

Considering the line already has to stretch outside for most events, I would suggest you check the forecast and bring an umbrella. (We will note this in the website posting.) In the past, some lines have stayed inside, but we cannot do this anymore because the hotel and the fire marshal don't like us doing it.


I'm probably going to get flamed at for this, but I've got to say it. This really shouldn't be feasible. Its a serious and realistic health risk. Your just asking for a whole lot of people to get sick from getting soaked. I understand fire codes and hotel rules, but when people get sick from being wet (because, even if you have an umbrella your going to get wet.)it could get even worse. If people are wet, they are going to stay wet through the whole programing. Some of which is several hours long. They cant go in, get their seat, and then leave to change after all. There has been a lot of talk about asthmatics and smoking on this thread, but this is relevant to them as well. People with respiratory illnesses are even more susceptible then normal people. I know, I am one of them. Will they be included in the special needs seating? My guess is not.
I'm sorry if this seems rude to you, but this is a very real concern for me. If you get some of those long line tents that may help, but it'd still be very cold most likely. That could promote illness too. Also, once in the main programming, it could really start to smell from all the wet gross bodies around. Personally I dont know why they stopped ticketing events (they may have had a very good reason.) I wasnt going to ACen when they did, but if inside lines are so against the rules, then maybe you need to look at this option again. It would prevent people who want to go to an event to have to choose between their safety and going.

This post has been edited by KungPowKirby: 23 April 2011 - 04:21 PM

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#41 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 04:23 PM

View PostSmokey, on 23 April 2011 - 03:41 PM, said:

Depending on the severity of your condition, yes. We can get you around the lines if needed. Stop by either of our locations when you arrive and we'll fill you in on everything you'll need to know. We're right at the entrance to Registration in the convention center, and near the front entrances to the Hyatt, next to the Customer Service counter.


Okay, so I MIGHT be in the regular line or the special needs line, as it varies depending on your condition. I...think I've got it now. I'll be stopping by once I arrive on Friday morning.
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#42 User is offline   Smokey 

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Posted 23 April 2011 - 05:45 PM

View PostKokoro, on 23 April 2011 - 04:23 PM, said:

Okay, so I MIGHT be in the regular line or the special needs line, as it varies depending on your condition. I...think I've got it now. I'll be stopping by once I arrive on Friday morning.

PM or email me with more details about your situation and I'll let you know which extended courtesies you qualify for.

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#43 User is offline   lmw_mcol 

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Posted 13 May 2011 - 10:12 PM

Thank you for addressing our concerns, I appreciate you making an effort for everyone to have a chance at enjoying events. I hope this works well since I haven't been to ACEN in two years, things change, systems changed, a lot since '09.

#44 User is offline   madhattr999 

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 09:57 PM

Obviously, the policy is not going to get changed at this point regardless of what I say here, but I'll say it anyway. This type of queue management has a history of failure. 1 hour before the masquerade, you're just gonna have a big clump of people, instead of a big line of people. And when "lining up officially starts", there will be a bunch of people running, pushing, and shoving to get to the front. And the further away people are herded from the entrance, the longer the stretch of running that will occur.

I've argued with people in the past about this at other conventions, and ultimately, they insist that this method is easiest until someone gets hurt and then they retract the policy for the following year. I am just hopeful that the con staff is prepared for this type of situation.

"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it. "

Just my two cents, anyway.

This post has been edited by madhattr999: 15 May 2011 - 10:05 PM


#45 User is offline   Gorilla Derby 

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Posted 15 May 2011 - 10:56 PM

View PostTheRabbi, on 15 March 2011 - 09:36 AM, said:

But I want to come 29 minutes before and get up near the head of the line.
Well, speaking realistically, that probably won't happen. But this way you shouldn't have to come 2 hours before just to get into the event.


So, I desperately love the Soap Bubble, and I'm willing to sacrifice other programming opportunities to get a decent spot in line (of course, I do /perfectly/ understand waiting until after the masquerade has started and everyone attending is in). I don't understand how that's wrong. Isn't most of life first come first serve? What's wrong with letting the people who waited the longest get first choice of seat, or get into the Soap Bubble first?

Also, I fear I don't see how this is going to be different from last year. Before you "allowed" a line to form, people still attempted to form their own line, it might not have been AT the start of the line, but it was where ever IRT stopped telling people they couldn't be. If they tried to disperse a line, it became more of a blob. And if you enforce this more strongly, then when the line is allowed to form, it will get very chaotic very quickly.

All this seems to be doing is eliminating a sense of structure that the congoers themselves created. If people are in the designated line, they won't be where people are randomly wandering. And the more you enforce this, the more these congers will take up of the other congoers' space.

It's not that I want to take whatever opportunity works out best for me, but I don't see how this really solves any "problems".

#46 User is offline   TheRabbi 

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 08:32 AM

I understand that you-all have reservations about the line policy. But I am asking you to hold them and see how this works. The bottom line is: we've got a system that worked quite well last year (so yes, there is actual evidence for the success of this plan) and we're expanding it a little bit to cover the areas it missed. It may not hit every issue that comes up, or it may not be the solution you would have come up with, but it's how we're going to roll this year. And next year, we will see how this worked and adjust again.

So please, come at this with an open mind and give it a chance this year.
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#47 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 03:01 PM

I'm a litte confused after seeing this:

But I want to come 29 minutes before and get up near the head of the line.
Well, speaking realistically, that probably won't happen. But this way you shouldn't have to come 2 hours before just to get into the event.

So technically we DO have to break the rules by coming over 30 minutes early to get a decent seat?

And the 30 minute line rule ONLY applies to main programming stuff? Not autograph sessions or panels?

This post has been edited by Kokoro: 17 May 2011 - 03:05 PM

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#48 User is offline   TheRabbi 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 03:07 PM

View PostKokoro, on 17 May 2011 - 03:01 PM, said:

So technically we DO have to break the rules by coming over 30 minutes early to get a decent seat?

Just about every seat in the place is a decent seat. That FAQ was mostly for people who insist on being waaaaay up near the front.

Quote

And the 30 minute line rule ONLY applies to main programming stuff? Not autograph sessions or panels?

Only to major events happening in Main Programming. Panels don't generally have lines that require IRT supervision, and autograph lines are in a place where the lines are much better-defined.
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#49 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 03:13 PM

Well, I'd like to be close to the front if possible.

How early is it recommended to go to guest panels and autograph sessions, then?
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#50 User is offline   TheRabbi 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 03:18 PM

There is generally not an issue getting into guest panels or autograph sessions. Getting there a little early - 10 minutes or so - might be advisable, but no more.
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#51 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 03:21 PM

Seriously? That late? At Anime Milwaukee, which is way smaller, I went, like, 40 minutes early to some panels. I've also heard some people sighing over past autograph session lines being closed early, so I don't wanna be at the very end.
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#52 User is offline   TheRabbi 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 03:43 PM

I won't say that there aren't some panels that are extremely popular. But I will say that I can't predict which those will be.

Autograph sessions usually extend for the time they're scheduled for. Occasionally there is a change to a guest's schedule which necessitates them leaving earlier than planned, but it's not very common.
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#53 User is offline   Jnkolm 

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 10:01 PM

I have an event at 8 on Friday. I guess that might make our group one of the guinea pigs for the line idea. A shame, my brother and I usually like walking down the line to talk to people and entertain them, which will be difficult if everyone's outside and only for 30 minutes XD hopefully it all works out though. Will people running events be able to have any say on letting people in? (as in we're all done setting up and would like to let people sit to ensure we get full use of our time slot, kind of thing)
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#54 User is offline   TheRabbi 

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Posted 18 May 2011 - 01:15 AM

This procedure only applies for events in Main Programming (the Grand Ballroom) that traditionally draw long lines. Namely: opening ceremonies, the concerts, the Masquerade, the Soap Bubble, Anime Hell, closing ceremonies. (I'm sure I've missed at least one.) All of those events are con-run, so your question doesn't really apply...
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#55 User is offline   The Ghost of Acen 

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Posted 18 May 2011 - 12:24 PM

so glad I'm in the masquerade. But for the FLOW concert, I'm going. no power in the verse can stop me.
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#56 User is offline   Exezer 

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Posted 18 May 2011 - 12:42 PM

So true ...about the FLOW concert hehe.

#57 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 18 May 2011 - 06:54 PM

Wait - I've never been to Acen, so I'm not familiar with where the lines go (for main programming), but I thought I read somewhere that they extend outside. What happens if it's raining/storming?
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#58 User is offline   The Ghost of Acen 

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Posted 19 May 2011 - 11:52 AM

you'll get wet. unless you wear a poncho or something
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#59 User is offline   Kokoro 

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Posted 19 May 2011 - 12:22 PM

Oh, man. Awesome. :thumbdown: Guess I'll bring a really big umbrella. I can't get my wig and outfit wet.
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Posted 24 May 2011 - 09:59 PM

So I have some complaints regarding the line process.
1st- IRT did not stop people smoking from the revolving doors near the main programming line on Saturday.
2nd- The lining up 1/2 hour before the event starts was not strictly enforced.

The flow concert started at 6pm on Friday night, and people are supposed to line up at 5:30 pm. The line started at 4pm and IRT did not enforce the rules. I even saw an IRT volunteer encourage people lining up early and making sure they were energetic for the concert.

As a result, a group of us decided to get in line early for the masquerade line. The line started at 3pm, and then IRT decides to kick us out. However, if IRT can't follow the rules on Friday, why should fans listen to IRT on Saturday. I even told the IRT volunteer about what happened, and he was like that was Friday, today is Saturday. Therefore, IRT needs to get their act together. You can't have one day have people breaking the rules, and the next day following them. After IRT dispersed us in lines that day, 5 minutes later he told us to get back in line. IRT definitely made some fans pissed because they got out of line and were going to come back at the proper time. Only later to find out that they could have stayed, and now had to start at the back of the line.

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