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The next four years....

#1 User is offline   rondo 

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 09:23 AM

A spinoff of the Voted thread, this topic is about the next four years of our national government. The focus of the discussion is with President Obama, our elected officials in Congress, and what they need to get done in these upcoming four years to get this country in better shape than it is in today.

This thread is serious/semi-serious in its nature and debating is expected. Please make sure that spirited discussions do not turn into attacks on individuals. When making your arguments, if you are able to provide any facts/details to back you up, please do so but also be wary of your sources and the integrity of their presented information.

Here are some topics that could be discussed:

The "fiscal cliff"
National Debt
Taxes
The marijuana conflict between the state and federal level.
Foreign Policy
Immigration Reform
The debate between "taste great" and "less filling"

This post has been edited by rondo: 10 November 2012 - 09:28 AM


#2 User is offline   XenoBlade 

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 11:50 AM

Wanted to continue from what sent replied to me, when I said obama curbstomped Romney. Popular vote? Goodness no. It was mad close. Electoral college? No, it was a sound thrashing. Romney only won one battleground state. Not really close like that.

Speaking on foreign affairs, I feel at ease, because Romney was quite possibly the worst person ive seen with foreign relations. Seriously, give him an achievement for being barred from entering parliament. Tho not throwing salt at Romney fans.
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Posted 10 November 2012 - 01:12 PM

http://theweek.com/a...-need-to-do-now

I found this article yesterday. NOTE: I am not, by any means, attacking Republicans here on the forums, or asking them to change. My husband and I may be more liberal, but we know that Liberals and Democrats have their own faults too. Even so, we agree that we would feel much better about the Republican party if some of this article were taken to heart.

If Republicans want to be taken seriously on certain platforms, such as abortion, then they themselves need to come together, stop being so fragmented, and come up with a standard position. Romney destroyed himself by suddenly switching from a moderate to a hardcore conservative in order to pander to the Tea Party. The GOP needs to improve from within, and take solid stances on issues - but also be willing to compromise.
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#4 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 08:10 PM

View PostXenoBlade, on 10 November 2012 - 11:50 AM, said:

Wanted to continue from what sent replied to me, when I said obama curbstomped Romney. Popular vote? Goodness no. It was mad close. Electoral college? No, it was a sound thrashing. Romney only won one battleground state. Not really close like that.

Speaking on foreign affairs, I feel at ease, because Romney was quite possibly the worst person ive seen with foreign relations. Seriously, give him an achievement for being barred from entering parliament. Tho not throwing salt at Romney fans.


True, the electoral college was a pounding we haven't seen in awhile, especially after Romney lost Florida. Romney only took two states from Obama from 2008 (Indiana, which was suspected would go Republican this year, and North Carolina). In the battleground states, though, the vote margin was less than 4%. It's looking now that, had voters not stayed home, Romney might've edged it. The Electoral College is a winner-take-all deal, so often blowouts aren't quite as telling as they might be.

All that said, there's no question Obama trounced Romney. The way he did so should be studied by parties and political scientists. Obama skillfully built a solid coalition and got out the vote much better. Did he run a negative campaign? Sure, but that's politics. Romney probably should've hit Obama harder. That first debate nearly sank Obama. But there's no denying that Obama is probably the most skilled campaigner this nation has seen since Bill Clinton.

Foreign affairs? Not so much. Iran sure looks intimidated by Obama--must be why Ahmadinejad endorsed him. Israel feels that they've been basically abandoned. While I don't think Obama would actually abandon Israel, he's showing weakness in a region that respects only force and the willingness to use it. That makes war more likely rather than less. An Israel that feels abandoned is one that's going to say "Screw it, we're on our own" and go after Iran. The Gulf Kingdoms can't be feeling good about rumors of negotiations with Iran, either.

China doesn't seem to be bothered by Obama either--though that may change if we end up with a trade war with them, something both parties agreed on (I don't, personally). I do think China is overrated as a threat, but again, showing some toughness would be helpful in bolstering our allies. Talking about defense cuts is not showing toughness.

If Obama kills missile defense with Russia, something he's promised them to be "more flexible" on, it will not only leave this nation more vulnerable, Eastern Europe will no longer trust us, and be right to. That will damage NATO, which is about the only stable alliance the world has going now.

And I don't think we want to start talking about Benghazi--where Obama and his aides watched a consulate get overrun for nine hours, had a military response ready to go...and did nothing. Four Americans died as a result, one of them an ambassador. I really want to know why Obama decided they weren't worth the trouble, and I'm really hoping it wasn't so his administration could keep up the fiction that the terrorists were pissed off about a stupid YouTube video, rather than al-Qaeda.

And speaking of al-Qaeda, they're not dead, but still very much active and in Mali...the next stop on the US military's Whack-A-Mole Tour. I'm okay with Obama going after AQ wherever they may be. I'm not okay with him claiming that he's the man who killed AQ during the campaign then planning a major military operation to kill the thing that's supposed to be dead.

Would Romney have been any better? Hard to tell. Foreign relations is always a tricky business. But I can tell you he wouldn't be any worse. If you're afraid of the evil Romney getting us into a war, then you should be doubly terrified of an incompetent Obama who all but guarantees it.

I do think we should probably stick to debating this on the "Crazy World" thread, though. I love talking politics, but we shouldn't overrun Chit-Chat with them.

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#5 User is offline   rondo 

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 09:24 PM

View Postsentinel28a, on 10 November 2012 - 08:10 PM, said:


I do think we should probably stick to debating this on the "Crazy World" thread, though. I love talking politics, but we shouldn't overrun Chit-Chat with them.

Ben Da Mad Irishman


The reason for the Crazy World thread was pretty much a general discussion about overall world events. This thread in particular was to continue discussions started in the Voted thread and to focus on the internal struggles of the US. They don't need to be redundant.

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 12:38 PM

Just a friendly reminder to keep it clean here. I am not seeing any problems yet, but as a lot of political threads are wont to do, it can go bad in a hurry.

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:21 PM

Am I the only one that feels that people have double standards about people in this country in general?

Like most of us came from other countries in the past but since we were "born," here recently, Americans consider themselves "above," other people, including Americans themselves. Elistist attitude?

I seem to remember in history that people spoke more than one language at one point, even when English was established as the main language in the USA. French/English was common. So what happened? Did Americans get lazy in general?

In most countries they have different immigration policies but I don't know any country that has exactly "one," language spoken. Most have several or combinations:

Japanese: Chinese and Japanese along with Korean. Even the Japanese don't know all of the Japanese Kanji known. Most Japanese people know enough to speak it and get by.

Chinese: Two different types of Chinese: Traditional as well as conventional to the point that you need to learn both to speak to some Chinese people. The Chinese spoken in Chinatown in Chicago is mostly Cantonese but a lot of Chinese speak Mandarin as well. This gets confusing but they still get by.

Russia: Russian official throughout nation; twenty-seven others co-official in various regions English (78% out of all foreign language speakers, i.e. 11.7% of the population) German (16%) French (4%) Turkish (2%)

Switzerland: German, French, and Italian.

I heard this as an excuse on why there shouldn't be anyone from South America or any country in general unless it's a "visit," because this is an "English speaking only country," and a lot of Americans feel that there should be really strict foreign policies. I even hear Americans say that there should only be "Americans only here," and "American only products."

DS brought up a point with the manuals in other languages and made me think about the above.

This post has been edited by The Fujoshi: 11 November 2012 - 09:22 PM

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:03 AM

View Postrondo, on 10 November 2012 - 09:23 AM, said:

A spinoff of the Voted thread, this topic is about the next four years of our national government. The focus of the discussion is with President Obama, our elected officials in Congress, and what they need to get done in these upcoming four years to get this country in better shape than it is in today.

This thread is serious/semi-serious in its nature and debating is expected. Please make sure that spirited discussions do not turn into attacks on individuals. When making your arguments, if you are able to provide any facts/details to back you up, please do so but also be wary of your sources and the integrity of their presented information.

Here are some topics that could be discussed:

The "fiscal cliff"
National Debt
Taxes
The marijuana conflict between the state and federal level.
Foreign Policy
Immigration Reform
The debate between "taste great" and "less filling"

Fiscal cliff: Hope it gets resolveds soon since I'm already getting paid less then minieum wage after takes are taken out.
National debt: If Greece is any indicator on what we are becoming then our debt will continue to go up. And as soon as any efforts are taken to curb it, we will see people shouting rants of racism, elitlesm, and hate
Foreign Policy: It's currently a joke. And unless the extremests of reglion back down (yes, that does include extremist christians too) then it's only gonna get worse.
Immigration Reform: Also a joke. Mexico actually has a harsher immigration policy then we do. In fact commericals were being played in spainish, on spainsih soap operas telling the public on how to get food stamps in America. Just another sign on our continuing dependancy on goverement.

I'll always prefer taste great over less filling any day. :P lol
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#9 User is offline   rondo 

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:14 AM

View PostThe Fujoshi, on 11 November 2012 - 09:21 PM, said:

Am I the only one that feels that people have double standards about people in this country in general?

Like most of us came from other countries in the past but since we were "born," here recently, Americans consider themselves "above," other people, including Americans themselves. Elistist attitude?

I seem to remember in history that people spoke more than one language at one point, even when English was established as the main language in the USA. French/English was common. So what happened? Did Americans get lazy in general?

In most countries they have different immigration policies but I don't know any country that has exactly "one," language spoken. Most have several or combinations:

Japanese: Chinese and Japanese along with Korean. Even the Japanese don't know all of the Japanese Kanji known. Most Japanese people know enough to speak it and get by.

Chinese: Two different types of Chinese: Traditional as well as conventional to the point that you need to learn both to speak to some Chinese people. The Chinese spoken in Chinatown in Chicago is mostly Cantonese but a lot of Chinese speak Mandarin as well. This gets confusing but they still get by.

Russia: Russian official throughout nation; twenty-seven others co-official in various regions English (78% out of all foreign language speakers, i.e. 11.7% of the population) German (16%) French (4%) Turkish (2%)

Switzerland: German, French, and Italian.

I heard this as an excuse on why there shouldn't be anyone from South America or any country in general unless it's a "visit," because this is an "English speaking only country," and a lot of Americans feel that there should be really strict foreign policies. I even hear Americans say that there should only be "Americans only here," and "American only products."

DS brought up a point with the manuals in other languages and made me think about the above.


I learned Spanish as a second language back in the schools days..however I haven't had a need for it since those days. I can remember the basics and simple structure but holding a conversation isn't all that easy.

I don't think it is so much about being 'above' other countries as much as it is other countries needing to do business with the US. And with the US being pretty important in the grand scheme of things, I imagine other countries find a it quite important to speak American English. If anything, the US needs to learn Chinese, in one of its various forms.

=====

Let's see, as a result of the impending further implementation of the Healthcare Reform Act or..whatever it is called, we are seeing some hiring news...much of it on the negative side as of late. Will the firings continue?

This post has been edited by rondo: 12 November 2012 - 07:16 AM


#10 User is offline   rondo 

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 10:29 AM

Also..we have quite a few defections taking place with Obama's cabinet. Then you have General P, who's resignation is oddly timed with all the Libya talk going on. And Clinton is too busy. This libya thing looks more fishy as time goes on.

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:32 PM

Of note regarding the language issue, the main fact is that most nations do have a main language that is the common or most spoken form of language.

France, it's french, but people do know other languages. However not all french people are going to be biliquale, as such if you go to france you have to know some french or you're screwed. Same here in the states in a way, if you don't know english or spanish then people can't help you because not everyone will have studied three languages.

Regarding the other things.

Fiscal cliff: congress fix this now please! We don't need another depression thank you.

National debt: We need to start recondidering the idea of a national bank, or at least maybe consider breaking the larger banks into smaller ones again. Honestly let's face it, we're going to need to pay for this for a long while. We don't want to have inflation issues either.

Foreign Policy: Needs a lot of work. Given the way things are we have to start getting other countries to either talk it out, or just say bye bye to some of them until they can behave. We can't be everyone's big brother.

Immigration Reform: Needs fixing, but at the same time we have to get other countries to work with us too. People are coming here not only to get money but also because of all the nastiness happening in South and Central america. There has to be a balance.

Libya and Petraus: Libya is something that will certainly need to be fixed, that whole situation is a mess. As for Petraus, do we even need to get into that screwy scandal?
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#12 User is offline   The Fujoshi 

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:49 PM

http://news.yahoo.co...-190210006.html

Is this real?

@Rondo: I dunno; I know some Pinoys (from PH) who feel this way as well so it's not only a USA thing. One girl argued with another girl and called her "stupid," because she only knew English and not Tagalog/English and the Pinoy girl refused to speak in English to her. Maybe its some native mentality or something.
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:54 PM

Fiscal cliff wouldn't likely lead to another depression. It would be a double-dip recession, which is almost as bad. Either way, it has to be addressed, and both sides are going to have to give. I read an interesting article that a few ways no one's tried yet are these:

1) Tax wealth rather than income on rich people--in other words, tax everything. If done right, this could spread the tax burden around to be more fair, and make sure yachts and such get taxed along with money made. Also, end the Hollywood tax credits. Lucas just pocketed $4 billion; he doesn't need to get a tax credit to make his next non-Star Wars bomb. (Like Redtails, which wasn't bad but could've been so much better.)

2) Eliminate a big provision of Obamacare/Affordable Health Act. According to the current rules, you're eligible for Obamacare coverage at 120% of your median income. The median income in the US is about $40,000. That means you can be making well over $100,000 and still be eligible for Obamacare benefits. That doesn't make a lot of sense. If you're making over $100,000 you can probably afford your own insurance.

3) Reduce Obamacare coverage to ER visits and allow money that would normally be paid into Obamacare tax-wise to be put instead into Health Savings Accounts (HSAs). This would give the end-user more control over the money. (It doesn't solve the problems of ER doctor shortages--already happening--or long-term care, however.)

4) Tax endowments of colleges, with a sliding scale--Podunk U (basically, where I work) would not have to pay much, but Harvard--whose endowments are equal to some African countries entire GNP--would.

5) Streamline and improve the tax code to eliminate loopholes. Ironically, this was Romney's idea. Even more ironically, one plan that Obama is supposedly considering is a joint "fiscal cliff" commission chaired by Bill Clinton...and Mitt Romney.

As far as the foreign language thing goes, I would have no problem with Spanish being taught as a mandatory language in school (much like French is taught in Canada). However, I do think that immigrants coming here should also learn to speak English. My forebears showed up in 1840 speaking a little English and a lot of Gaelic. They weren't given the option--they learned English or starved. It's not elitist to ask immigrants coming here to do the same.

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 07:56 PM

http://news.yahoo.co...-193245743.html
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Posted 12 November 2012 - 11:55 PM

View PostThe Fujoshi, on 12 November 2012 - 07:49 PM, said:

http://news.yahoo.co...-190210006.html

Is this real?

@Rondo: I dunno; I know some Pinoys (from PH) who feel this way as well so it's not only a USA thing. One girl argued with another girl and called her "stupid," because she only knew English and not Tagalog/English and the Pinoy girl refused to speak in English to her. Maybe its some native mentality or something.

Real enough to get attention. What I think is funny about this is that we seceded from England to have the freedoms we have today. If enough people in the country belive are freedoms are at stake (and they are) Why not let them seceded? (besides for the whole ya know trying to build a whole new independant economy, goverenment, import regulations, etc.)
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 07:15 AM

Sorry i haven't replied sent. Hard to do so during the week. I hate long typing on my phone.

Also with the people wanting to leave? Idiots. Hicks. Not only will this not happen, it just shows the stupidity of the people who signed they'd fall flat at the beginning
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#17 User is offline   rondo 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:51 AM

As for the scandal thing, there are supposedly more people involved now in the military and all kinds of other nonsense. Let me put my tinfoil hat on and say it looks like they are overwhelming the public with so much info on this scandal that people will hopefully forget Libya.

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 01:52 PM

View Postrondo, on 13 November 2012 - 08:51 AM, said:

As for the scandal thing, there are supposedly more people involved now in the military and all kinds of other nonsense. Let me put my tinfoil hat on and say it looks like they are overwhelming the public with so much info on this scandal that people will hopefully forget Libya.


I think it'll actually make it worse. Petraeus was very much involved in Benghazi. The person leading the charge to get him to testify is Dianne Feinstein--a Democrat. This is not blowing over, and there's going to be a lot of questions asked. Hillary's leaving State, but if she's serious about running for President in 2016 (ha!), her involvement in this would torpedo her chances. Susan Rice is the frontrunner to replace Hillary, but Rice was the one screaming the loudest that this whole thing was over the YouTube video. If she said that and didn't know what really happened, the administration hung her out to dry. If she said that and did know what happened, she can probably write off getting to be Hillary's replacement. Not even the Democrats will touch her.

I agree with the secession thing, Xeno. It's dumb. It was dumb in 1861 and it's just as dumb now. The only way it would succeed is to have enough states support it, and the states you would need to support it might as well just launch a full-blown revolution. It would actually be easier to, say, march on Washington rather than try to form a whole new nation. Also note that the American Revolution succeeded only because we made it very expensive for the British to stay, and we got help from France. A civil war is different from a revolution, and there's no country to come help the revolutionaries this time--unless, of course, you want to get China to do it...

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 06:30 PM

View Postsentinel28a, on 12 November 2012 - 07:54 PM, said:

Fiscal cliff wouldn't likely lead to another depression. It would be a double-dip recession, which is almost as bad. Either way, it has to be addressed, and both sides are going to have to give. I read an interesting article that a few ways no one's tried yet are these:

1) Tax wealth rather than income on rich people--in other words, tax everything. If done right, this could spread the tax burden around to be more fair, and make sure yachts and such get taxed along with money made. Also, end the Hollywood tax credits. Lucas just pocketed $4 billion; he doesn't need to get a tax credit to make his next non-Star Wars bomb. (Like Redtails, which wasn't bad but could've been so much better.)

2) Eliminate a big provision of Obamacare/Affordable Health Act. According to the current rules, you're eligible for Obamacare coverage at 120% of your median income. The median income in the US is about $40,000. That means you can be making well over $100,000 and still be eligible for Obamacare benefits. That doesn't make a lot of sense. If you're making over $100,000 you can probably afford your own insurance.

3) Reduce Obamacare coverage to ER visits and allow money that would normally be paid into Obamacare tax-wise to be put instead into Health Savings Accounts (HSAs). This would give the end-user more control over the money. (It doesn't solve the problems of ER doctor shortages--already happening--or long-term care, however.)

4) Tax endowments of colleges, with a sliding scale--Podunk U (basically, where I work) would not have to pay much, but Harvard--whose endowments are equal to some African countries entire GNP--would.

5) Streamline and improve the tax code to eliminate loopholes. Ironically, this was Romney's idea. Even more ironically, one plan that Obama is supposedly considering is a joint "fiscal cliff" commission chaired by Bill Clinton...and Mitt Romney.



This isn't so bad but I wonder how much will people give and take.

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#20 User is offline   Valkyrie 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 07:56 PM

I'm not getting hopes up for Hillary to go for 2016. Although I think it'd be pretty cool, given her extensive experience in office (this is just my opinion, as naive as it may be to some), no one knows if she even wants to try for it yet, regardless of Libya, or even what she plans to do after leaving State. Plus, there's no real certainty as to who else will be trying to run. I can see Walker and Christie trying for it on the Republican side, although Walker's chances may (key word: may) already be slim given that recall he managed to avoid. Christie...I dunno. He's not exactly the sharpest tool in the shed at times, but who knows what'll happen in four years.

I do agree, though, that the petition-to-secede thing is just...well, dumb. Those states (or rather, the people pushing for these petitions within said states) are just butthurt because the election they all thought was going to go their way, didn't. And while it sounds like a glorious get-our-own-way-free card, secession won't help them. While they would probably have an easy(er?) time putting laws into place that most of the country doesn't want, they would still need their own currency, as well as their own military. To say nothing of the fact that even though Texas was once an independent republic for just shy of ten years, those ten years were back in 1836-1846. The nation as a whole has practically exploded since then, and that's leaving Mexico out of the equation.
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#21 User is offline   Unlucky Slayer 

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 11:23 AM

http://undeniableme....ng-of-seceding/

There is also this whole thing if the states are trying to leave the Union. lol
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#22 User is offline   kahad 

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 03:15 PM

Talking about leaving the Union is stupid. These people need to stop whining, and start thinking up some fresh ideas for the Republican party to working with in the 2014 elections.
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#23 User is offline   Dark Stranger 

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 03:17 PM

You mean like kicking out Republicans that can't seperate their religon from their politics? Wish that would happen. That's the main reason why they don't get anyone on the left to vote for them anyway.
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#24 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 12:37 AM

View PostDark Stranger, on 14 November 2012 - 03:17 PM, said:

You mean like kicking out Republicans that can't seperate their religon from their politics? Wish that would happen. That's the main reason why they don't get anyone on the left to vote for them anyway.


I doubt anyone on the left is going to vote Republican anyhow. Maybe if Obama ate a kitten and punched Elmo in the face on national TV...and I wouldn't care to take bets.

It's not a case of separating religion from politics. It's getting rid of stupid people. The Democrats could stand a housecleaning of stupid as well. Harry Reid insisting that there's nothing wrong with Social Security, when every damn report released by Social Security shows it's already going broke is quite possibly one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

Like my DM once said: you can disbelieve all you want; the dragon still eats you.

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 12:12 PM

I really dislike political talk, but this little tidbit is near and dear since I've worked in the food industry since I was 15...

These bigger food chains that have been threatening to cut their employee's hours to -just- under full time (which is generally marked at 30 hours a week.) so they don't have to provide affordable health care. It's been bad enough that: a: most chains make the health care so freaking expensive, so they can say they do provide it, but rarely can someone take up on it.. and the plans are crappier than COBRA. B: the average server makes $2.13-2.15 an hour and is then supplemented by tips. Many times, the employer will have the server report their tips, then make that count as their 'minimum wage'.. if they make under that (generally happens in the months of January-March or in bars if patrons find out their cocktailer is in a dedicated relationship or won't leave with them.)...too bad. They MUST be doing a crappy job. Instead of quietly raising their prices by a quarter or so, they're making a huge stink about it, trying to make people feel guilty for voting Democrat.. It's really calling attention to the kind of people these guys are to see this happening. Thousands of people will be out of jobs or will have to take on another job (if they can find it!) because they can't afford their homes.. it will also make things harder for people on SNAP since one of the requirements is that they need full-time hours, or they'll have to attend IMPACT training. They will have even more little time to spend taking care of their home life. It's bad enough that people with Masters degrees in engineering aren't even able to find work...

Bleh. /rantoff.

#26 User is offline   Dark Stranger 

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Posted 16 November 2012 - 08:17 PM

View Postsentinel28a, on 16 November 2012 - 12:37 AM, said:

I doubt anyone on the left is going to vote Republican anyhow. Maybe if Obama ate a kitten and punched Elmo in the face on national TV...and I wouldn't care to take bets.

It's not a case of separating religion from politics. It's getting rid of stupid people. The Democrats could stand a housecleaning of stupid as well. Harry Reid insisting that there's nothing wrong with Social Security, when every damn report released by Social Security shows it's already going broke is quite possibly one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

Like my DM once said: you can disbelieve all you want; the dragon still eats you.

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Yes, but then you have the senete race in my state of Indiana where murdock was leading untill he mentioned his extreme stance on not supporting abortion. (which comes from his relgion) and he lost. He had many things that I agreed with (cutting the department of education for one), But you can't trust those kinds of people to just focus on the tasks that need done without them trying to shove their reglious stances on social issues. That's where Rep lose millions of young votes and continue to lose in my mind.
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#27 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 07:50 PM

View PostDark Stranger, on 16 November 2012 - 08:17 PM, said:

Yes, but then you have the senete race in my state of Indiana where murdock was leading untill he mentioned his extreme stance on not supporting abortion. (which comes from his relgion) and he lost. He had many things that I agreed with (cutting the department of education for one), But you can't trust those kinds of people to just focus on the tasks that need done without them trying to shove their reglious stances on social issues. That's where Rep lose millions of young votes and continue to lose in my mind.


I have to agree with you on that. And the thing is, it's not necessary. Religion is a good moral compass to have (assuming you don't belong to some cult of Moloch or something), but most of the time you don't need to shove it into politics. You can't legislate morality.

What Mourdock should've said was "I think abortion is wrong." Period. He's a conservative; that's all he needs to say. That's all any politician needs to say. You can still be religious without having to remind everyone of the fact every ten seconds--and that goes for atheists, too. Probably 90% of Congress are religious people, and at least half of them go to church every week, I imagine, but you don't hear them making asinine statements like Mourdock and Akin. Heck, how often did Romney being a Mormon come up in the campaign?

We are a religious nation, and that's a good thing. The US has always been good about using religion as a guide, unlike Europe (where religion usually was an excuse to kill someone) or the Middle East (same). But mixing politics and religion is never a good idea.

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#28 User is offline   Dark Stranger 

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 01:14 PM

Glad I don't have a 401K. Since now the goverment is looking to take that from you next. *sigh*
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#29 User is offline   kahad 

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 03:19 PM

Apparently Obama can't grasp the difference between a stimulus bill and a debt-reduction bill.

We need a emoticon of a person banging their head on a wall. It would be perfect right now.
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#30 User is offline   mendokuse 

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 04:27 PM

View PostDark Stranger, on 30 November 2012 - 01:14 PM, said:

Glad I don't have a 401K. Since now the goverment is looking to take that from you next. *sigh*


Yeah, I've been eyeing my 401k and was thinking about starting to contribute to other retirement methods such as a Roth IRA/401k. It's funny, but once I turned 25 I really started thinking about saving up for retirement, kids, etc.
I'm not a financial planner or even a savvy spender (more of a sloppy spender :lol:/>/>), but everyone should start socking away some money in some way. Inflation, taxes, financial emergencies, you never know nowadays.

Retirement Cost

I usually hit B&N or the library and read Kiplinger, Money, and Consumers Digest. I wouldn't follow it word for word mind you. After all, by the time news hits print, it's a year old in internet time. But it is useful for general trends and guidelines.

This post has been edited by mendokuse: 30 November 2012 - 08:07 PM


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