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Romney or Obama 2012!

#151 User is offline   Unlucky Slayer 

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 10:05 PM

http://www.motherjon...vate-fundraiser

Just gonna leave this one here.
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#152 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 10:43 PM

View PostUnlucky Slayer, on 17 September 2012 - 10:05 PM, said:

http://www.motherjon...vate-fundraiser

Just gonna leave this one here.


For those of you who don't feel like clicking on the link, this is the situation in a nutshell: Romney said he's not going to get 47% of the nation to vote for him because they don't pay income tax and aren't likely to rock the boat of free government entitlement goodies by voting for a Republican.

Romney's right about a few things on this. One, he's right on numbers--47% of the nation at the moment don't pay income tax. Two, if current polls hold, indeed at least 47% of people will vote for Obama, barring an October meltdown or Obama doing something truly stupid. (Entirely possible with either candidate.) Three, Romney is somewhat correct in that, if he's going to win the election, he'll need to win the biggest voting bloc in the US: independents, people who don't vote party line one way or another. Romney estimates that as 4% of the population (giving him 51% of the vote and victory); actually, it's probably much larger. Again, going to the polls, Romney has a pretty hefty lead amongst independents, though Obama doesn't necessarily need the independents to all vote for him to win...only a few. Bush won in 2000 after losing independents by a wide margin and I believe Kennedy did as well in 1960 (though both elections were down to a razor-thin wire).

Now I'm a conservative (duh) and so I tend to defend Romney. I still do, but I think he could've worded this better. For one thing, not all the people who don't pay income tax are going to vote for Obama--in fact, if you're royally ticked about the economy, you're probably not going to vote for Obama. If you're broke, you're not paying income taxes.

The point he was trying to make here--and not doing a very good job of--is that the 47% who vote for Obama do so because they like sitting on their rears and collecting free government goodies. That is true for a substantial amount of people, but it's not entirely true. Some people are voting for Obama because they think he deserves another chance. Some are voting for Obama because they think he's a cool guy who likes comics. Some are voting for him because of skin color. (It's true, unfortunately. You'd think we would've moved beyond that by now and vote for the guy/girl because of accomplishments...) As much as I may disagree with Obama voters, I think it's a bit insulting to infer that they're all freeloaders.

I see where Romney's going with this--vote for Obama if you like living on government assistance for the rest of your life. True, welfare and food stamps use has risen in numbers not seen since the Depression during Obama's administration. The economy's crap and IMHO the Democrats keep wanting to kneecap it with regulations and refusing to acknowledge the $16 trillion deficit elephant in the room. Still, Romney could've said it far better, or not said it at all.

Then again, being stupid on the campaign trail doesn't necessarily screw everything up. Obama's remark about "clinging to guns and religion" (which, like Romney's remark, was made at a party fundraiser and was off-the-cuff) really torqued off people and allowed Hillary to win Pennsylvania in the Democrat primaries of 2008. Obviously, it didn't lead to President McCain.

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#153 User is offline   Unlucky Slayer 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 05:29 AM

Well, I voted for Obama in 08. Main reason is that I felt that he could do a better job than McCain.This year, all I know right now is that the republicans have blown up their bridge with me. I am the Middle Class Union Worker. republicans have done nothing but try to destroy my livelyhood for years. (Right To Work and other such bullplop.) I will be either voting for Obama again or Independent. As for my congresspeople for state and national, same deal.

Honestly that article I posted just keeps showing how far out of touch Romney really is with the rest of America. Its sad really. I voted Obama, I am the Middle Class, and I sure as heck pay my income taxes.
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#154 User is offline   rondo 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 07:22 AM

Yet another off the cuff remark made by a presidential candidate during an election year. It happens all the time, cycle after cycle. However, I am sure the media will do everything it its power to keep talking up Romney's comment.

#155 User is offline   The Fujoshi 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 08:22 AM

View Postsentinel28a, on 17 September 2012 - 08:50 PM, said:

In some countries people literally give their lives to vote, or just have the chance to.

I think that's another thing we can agree on: if you can vote, do so. It's better than the alternative.

Ben Da Mad Irishman


The problem with this country is that people take everything for granted or say how they have the right to have such liberties when in turn you really don't.

I rather live in Canada or here than say.....Africa or the Middle east. Or China; you want to be a woman in China? So that's why I vote. If you want someone to make decisions for you then move to China or the Middle east and sit on your butt. "Oh but nooooooooo because I'm an American I have the right to sit on my butt and complain if it doesn't go my way."

EDIT: I'm part of the middle class too, which is probably why I go dem or independent. If I had more money I would go con, but sadly I don't; the few examples of right wings I met all had money, a lot of money, (including my racist uncle.)

This post has been edited by The Fujoshi: 18 September 2012 - 08:23 AM

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 09:54 AM

One thing we can agree to...Obama uses big fluffy words that confuses a big chunk of his voters (which I agree with his not dumbing it down to an extent. Give a man a fish...teaching a man to fish scenario) And Romney has foot in his mouth problems. He is NOT a good speaker. (Also with hos comments good to know if he wins, he will pretty much ignore those same folk. Also Sent, you forgot to add, part of those 47% are the religious hicks who think Republicans really care about them.

Anywho, both can take a lesson from Clinton. You may or may not agreed with him...but you go to admit, during his presidency, and even now....he is a great speaker.
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#157 User is offline   YoungBirdcall 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 10:44 AM

View Postsentinel28a, on 17 September 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

Romney's right about a few things on this. One, he's right on numbers--47% of the nation at the moment don't pay [FEDERAL] income tax (I fixed that for you).

The point he was trying to make here--and not doing a very good job of--is that the 47% who vote for Obama do so because they like sitting on their rears and collecting free government goodies.
Ramesh Panaru, a widely read conservative pundit, did his utmost to warn the Right away from this way of thinking. It didn't work. From his article in the National Review in 2011: "The ten states with the highest number of non-payers are a strongly Republican bunch: eight of them went for John McCain in 2008, and nine of them have Republican governors." I don't understand how you (and others) can claim that this 47% of American citizens who don't pay federal income taxes are going to vote for Obama, no questions asked. This is flat-out wrong.

Here Is Why Mitt's Wrong on the 47%

From the article: "More than one-fifth of Romney's moocher 47% are elderly: people who pay no income taxes because their income takes the form of Social Security - many of those people are Republican voters. And as Ezra Klein pointed out yesterday, more than 60% of the 47% pay payroll taxes. At 15.3%, the payroll tax rate represents a higher rate of tax than that paid by Mitt Romney himself. Only about one-fifth of taxpayers are non-elderly people who pay no tax at all, and they are paying no tax mostly because they are unemployed in the worst economic crisis since the 1930s."


View Postsentinel28a, on 17 September 2012 - 10:43 PM, said:

I see where Romney's going with this--vote for Obama if you like living on government assistance for the rest of your life. True, welfare and food stamps use has risen in numbers not seen since the Depression during Obama's administration. The economy's crap and IMHO the Democrats keep wanting to kneecap it with regulations and refusing to acknowledge the $16 trillion deficit elephant in the room


Oh, you mean the deficit that was created by a predominantly Republican congress and the Republican two-term President, George W. Bush.
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#158 User is offline   kahad 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 11:13 AM

View PostYoungBirdcall, on 18 September 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

Oh, you mean the deficit that was created by a predominantly Republican congress and the Republican two-term President, George W. Bush.

We have had a deficit long before Bush.
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#159 User is offline   XenoBlade 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 11:46 AM

View Postkahad, on 18 September 2012 - 11:13 AM, said:

We have had a deficit long before Bush.


Yeah, like Reagan and Bush the 1st.
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#160 User is offline   kahad 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 12:31 PM

View PostXenoBlade, on 18 September 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

Yeah, like Reagan and Bush the 1st.

Before them too.

The local grocery store is selling some DVDs about the decades. On the back of the DVDs, they list things like the population, minimal wage, and federal deficit. Apparently we have had a deficit at least since the 40s.

If this website is correct, 1835 was the only year without a national debt.

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This post has been edited by kahad: 18 September 2012 - 12:34 PM

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#161 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 12:32 PM

View PostXenoBlade, on 18 September 2012 - 11:46 AM, said:

Yeah, like Reagan and Bush the 1st.


And FDR, who doubled federal spending in the Depression for the New Deal, and Johnson, who doubled it again for Great Society. Reagan increased it for the Cold War, and Bush II and Obama have doubled and tripled it. Obama's spent $4 tril in the past four years. The biggest deficit hawks in recent history have been Nixon (!), Bush I (somewhat), and Clinton. Clinton had a tendency to throw unfunded mandates on the states, but so has Bush II and Obama.

The deficit is a bipartisan eff-up. It doesn't really matter who started it now, only that it's there. So far, the only person I've heard talking about it is Paul Ryan--and even his plan is only a start. Obama hasn't mentioned it much, but he has mentioned another round of stimulus, which will a) not work and B) increase the deficit. Obama, if reelected, may not have a choice, though--the deficit's going to blow up at some point. It's entitlements that are causing it to spin out of control, and no way is Obama going to touch those. I think a good deal of Americans don't realize yet just how much trouble we're in. The Republicans are scared to talk about it and the Democrats seem to be sticking their fingers in their ears and yelling "LA LA LA! CAN'T HEAR YOU!"

Definitely agree on Clinton's gift of gab. Clinton knew how to talk to people. We make fun of him for saying "I feel yore pahn," but he was every bit as good as Reagan and Kennedy at reaching an audience. Hell, I like him and still do. Obama has a tendency to sound like he's lecturing me, and Romney has a tendency to bore the hell out of people. Clinton's the type of guy who could throw away the teleprompter and the note cards and still make a good speech. Obama noticeably flounders without his teleprompter, and Romney doesn't do off-the-cuff well. (Obama probably wishes he could keep Joe Biden tied up in a basement somewhere for his gaffes. In fairness, Bush always sounded like he was gargling marbles.) Chris Christie is about the only Republican I can name off the top of my head who speaks well.

Back to Romney's gaffe. Again, he's on the right track on entitlements--we can't afford them much longer. Some reform is going to have to be done. Social Security's probably gone for Generation X and Millenials. Medicare is in terrible shape. Already something like ten states are opting out of the Medicare increase because they simply can't afford it (and they're not all red states). We can save SS for the Boomers, and maybe get Medicare under control, but it's going to take a lot of work. What candidates need to do is acknowledge the problem...before it hits, and it will. After it starts sucking the life out of the GNP, then massive cuts will hit everything.

And there is an overreliance on federal government that needs to stop. A good example is people asking why Obama hasn't stepped in to end the Chicago teacher's strike. He hasn't because it would be stupid, an overreach of Presidential powers, and likely to at least piss off somebody he needs to keep happy--but the fact that people are even asking such an insipid question says a lot about how much we've come to rely on government.

When it comes to old folks--Boomers--Romney has a big lead over Obama. Every poll I've seen, even those slanted towards Democrats, gives him an 8-18 point lead amongst the older demographic. (Obama by contrast has the youth vote by a similar lead; they're split on everyone else, about evenly.) That's surprising, but with that much of a cushion, I don't think this is going to hurt Romney, any more than Biden's idiot comment about blacks going back into slavery if the Republicans win (which is insulting to all human intelligence) hurt Obama overmuch. I have to give some props to Romney for using the Tyrion Lannister Strategy--if someone calls you something, own it and turn it to your advantage.

Voters tend to regard political candidates as morons, so when they misspeak, it usually doesn't sway them, unless it's a huge gaffe (that would be you, Senator Akin). This isn't. A good way of telling if a gaffe is going to stick is how it resonates with the candidate's own party. If they shrug it off or laugh, probably it's not going to do anything. If they agree with it, it might even help. (There were some comments on NBC's boards last night where people were saying "It's about time someone started talking tough!") If your own party is screaming for your head, you really screwed up. (Again, Akin. If liberals think they were mad about "legitimate rape," conservatives wanted Akin to leap off the Gateway Arch.)

Remember that at this point, Romney's going for independent votes. Democrats in heavy blue states are not likely to vote for Romney, even if Obama ate a kitten on national TV. Republicans are going to vote for Romney, even if he pantsed Sarah Palin on Fox. The 12% of independent voters are going to be what turns this election--and it may come down to four states, or just one, Ohio. Romney wins Ohio, and Obama has to sweep the other three states--Colorado (likely), Wisconsin (no telling), and Florida (not likely). If Obama wins Ohio, Romney's pretty much going to need a clean sweep of all three states too, or flip Michigan (not likely).

We'll see. I'm voting for the bunch that at least looks at their 16th martini and says, "Maybe I'd better stop," rather than the ones who are ordering another round on the house.

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#162 User is offline   minecraftsmurf 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 01:35 PM

View PostThe Fujoshi, on 13 September 2012 - 06:50 PM, said:

Words can turn into truth or viewed as so. Why you think some jobs look at people's facebooks, google their name or username from forums/conversations, or browser history at work? Or why people get fired over gossip?

Same goes for fetishes; if you like Guro there is a chance that you like doing guro irl.

30 minute read? I can read your post in five seconds or in less than a minute. People are self center to a fault and lazy when it comes to everything else or everyone else. So a lot of people say or do the whole "tl;dr," but then want to argue against your point.

If someone has enough time to write a 30 minute counter post then they have enough time to read and understand someone's post to not sound like an butt. It turns into a "NO U."


*shew* straight over the head... this is not Facebook... my posts are relativity short... your super human self cant read long posts from others with multiple links in 30 seconds...

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 01:37 PM

View PostYoungBirdcall, on 18 September 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

Ramesh Panaru, a widely read conservative pundit, did his utmost to warn the Right away from this way of thinking. It didn't work. From his article in the National Review in 2011: "The ten states with the highest number of non-payers are a strongly Republican bunch: eight of them went for John McCain in 2008, and nine of them have Republican governors." I don't understand how you (and others) can claim that this 47% of American citizens who don't pay federal income taxes are going to vote for Obama, no questions asked. This is flat-out wrong.

It's not that they will vote for him because they don't pay taxes. They will vote for him because they barley have to lift a finger and get goverment checks for everything. It's human nature, if someone pays you to not work, there is no incentive to go out and make a better life yourself. It happens alot with college kids who don't work. Why bother? Free room, food, no bills, lifes pretty sweet. Humans almost always need a kick in the rear to get them going and make positive changes. Lord knows I've waited til something has gone wrong for me to say, "wtf am I doing?" and change it. Someone who is on every goverment program avaiable will look at the election like this. This guy is still gonna give me money, this other guy wants to take it away. Even though taking it away would be a positive in the long run they will pick the person handing them money. Why? Because it's easy. And we Americans are all about easy. So trying to sway those people away is going to be pointless and much harder then trying to turn people who are actually working.
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#164 User is offline   minecraftsmurf 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 01:39 PM

View PostThe Fujoshi, on 16 September 2012 - 07:36 AM, said:

Huh this post confused me. Who would of won last year?

I'm mostly lurking the thread and reading the consers put down Obama and the Dems put down Romney so I'm doing this:

Posted Image

I mean both of them suck in general and we know Sent would do better than both of them in this case so it's hilarious to put down one to prep up the other like they are the less than great evils.

Yeah....right.


I agree I dislike some characteristics of both, and I have my own ideals of what I would do to repair this great country. What are your ideals to rebuild America?

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 01:43 PM

This:

"It’s so amusing to me. All I hear out of elitist liberals is that the rich do not pay enough in taxes… that the evil corporations that supply thousands of jobs do not pay enough in taxes. When, in reality, they pay nearly 60% of the entire nation’s tax burden. How much is enough for the top 10% of the 2/3’s of Americans who work? How much would satisfy you… 75%... 90%... or how about 100% so the ‘emerging’ class who already lacks a work ethic won’t need one at all?

Do you really think that this world is fair? Do you really think that everyone is equal… that everyone is ‘entitled’ to succeed? I hate to be the evil one to break a childhood fantasy… but this world is still a dog eat dog world dominated by a manipulative species of mammal that is still evolving… that still obeys natures laws including natural selection.

The ‘emerging’ generation can barely handle general level classes in high school where 40% of your grade is based on attendance... but hey… it’s not their fault right? Blame video games, the schools, the teachers, television, and of course, the evil corporations… we can’t let individuals take reasonability for their individual decisions and ignorant (un taught) ideals. They are just victims right? This generation feels that they are ‘entitled’ to a satisfactory lifestyle where all of their needs and their general ‘wants’ are supplied."

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 01:54 PM

View Postrondo, on 18 September 2012 - 07:22 AM, said:

Yet another off the cuff remark made by a presidential candidate during an election year. It happens all the time, cycle after cycle. However, I am sure the media will do everything it its power to keep talking up Romney's comment.


Idk, I agree 100% with Romney's remark about the 47%. They are dependent people... no real desire (motivation), or personal satisfaction to step up and deal with reality... they would rather be coddled and be told everything is rainbows. But guess what... they are not entitled to a satisfactory lifestyle on the governments dime. Eventually, regardless of who is president... the funds will not always be there. Natural Selection.

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 02:11 PM

If "elitist " liberal words are the rich don't pay enough, then the elitist conservative view is the non tax payers are all just lazy. Really? So each and every person just sits and wants free money. Right. Gonna edit when im less busy at work
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#168 User is offline   YoungBirdcall 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 02:18 PM

View Postkahad, on 18 September 2012 - 11:13 AM, said:

We have had a deficit long before Bush.


I was referring to the fact that Clinton, a two-term Democrat president, left office with the country having a surplus. George W. Bush and a predominantly Republican Congress racked up a tremendously huge deficit, and now we find the Republican Party attempting to pin the budget crisis on President Obama. This is a disingenuous argument, and a demonstrably false one.
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#169 User is offline   YoungBirdcall 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 02:27 PM

View Postminecraftsmurf, on 18 September 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

Idk, I agree 100% with Romney's remark about the 47%. They are dependent people... no real desire (motivation), or personal satisfaction to step up and deal with reality... they would rather be coddled and be told everything is rainbows. But guess what... they are not entitled to a satisfactory lifestyle on the governments dime. Eventually, regardless of who is president... the funds will not always be there. Natural Selection.


I'll say it again, since no one seems to bother with pesky things like "facts" - these "dependent people" you speak of are predominantly Republicans. "The ten states with the highest number of non-[federal income tax]-payers are a strongly Republican bunch: eight of them went for John McCain in 2008, and nine of them have Republican governors." - Ramesh Panaru, a widely read conservative pundit.

Furthermore: Here Is Why Mitt (and the rest of you) Is (are) Wrong on the 47%

From the article: "More than one-fifth of Romney's "moocher 47%" are elderly: people who pay no income taxes because their income takes the form of Social Security - many, [many] of those people are Republican voters. And as Ezra Klein pointed out, more than 60% of the 47% pay payroll taxes. At 15.3%, the payroll tax rate represents a higher rate of tax than that paid by Mitt Romney himself. Only about one-fifth of taxpayers are non-elderly people who pay no [federal income] tax at all, and they are paying no tax mostly because they are unemployed in the worst economic crisis since the 1930s."

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 03:47 PM

http://www.reuters.c...E88G19620120918

The more words that comes out of Romney's mouth -- the more evident it becomes on his inability to function as President. The 47% comment shows his disdain for the "common" people, or anyone who disagrees with him. On top of that, he's not a man of peace. He's a man of war: drumming up and provoking any potential confrontation with Iran and Palestine.

The world will be much much worse with Romney as President.
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#171 User is offline   Dark Stranger 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 04:00 PM

View PostYoungBirdcall, on 18 September 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

I'll say it again, since no one seems to bother with pesky things like "facts" - these "dependent people" you speak of are predominantly Republicans. "The ten states with the highest number of non-[federal income tax]-payers are a strongly Republican bunch: eight of them went for John McCain in 2008, and nine of them have Republican governors." - Ramesh Panaru, a widely read conservative pundit.

Furthermore: Here Is Why Mitt (and the rest of you) Is (are) Wrong on the 47%

From the article: "More than one-fifth of Romney's "moocher 47%" are elderly: people who pay no income taxes because their income takes the form of Social Security - many, [many] of those people are Republican voters. And as Ezra Klein pointed out, more than 60% of the 47% pay payroll taxes. At 15.3%, the payroll tax rate represents a higher rate of tax than that paid by Mitt Romney himself. Only about one-fifth of taxpayers are non-elderly people who pay no [federal income] tax at all, and they are paying no tax mostly because they are unemployed in the worst economic crisis since the 1930s."

And for the record, MineCraftSmurf, you sound like Ayn Rand, and that is not a compliment.

We weren't talking about taxes. We were talking about the dependent additude of this generation. And most of Obama supporters have that dependent additude. So why go after them?

Also we have never had a surplus. We have always had debt. Even under Clinton.

And I say being Ayn Rann is a compliment. At least it means your responsable enough for you're own actions.
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#172 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 06:38 PM

View PostKyuu, on 18 September 2012 - 03:47 PM, said:

http://www.reuters.c...E88G19620120918

The more words that comes out of Romney's mouth -- the more evident it becomes on his inability to function as President. The 47% comment shows his disdain for the "common" people, or anyone who disagrees with him. On top of that, he's not a man of peace. He's a man of war: drumming up and provoking any potential confrontation with Iran and Palestine.

The world will be much much worse with Romney as President.


The more words that comes out of Obama's mouth--the more evident it becomes on his inability to function as President. The bitter clingers, we belong to the government, and you didn't build that shows his disdain for the "common" people, or anyone who disagrees with him. On top of that, he's not a man of peace. He's a man of war: drumming up and provoking any potential confrontation with Iran, Libya, Syria, and Egypt.

Welcome to politics. I can turn a phrase to support my candidate too, and quote gaffes with the best of 'em.

Okay, snark off, Kyuu. But let's remember: Obama went after Qaddafi. He put more troops in Afghanistan. And he was right to do both.

Iran's leaders have said they want to destroy Israel, and wouldn't mind putting a nuke or two on American soil either. That's not Obama saying that, or Romney. It's Ahmadinejad. If Iran gets nukes, Israel's going after them. Obama has told Israel "we've got your back." If he goes back on that promise, he will enrage over half the country, and prove once and for all that, while America may be a dangerous ally, we're an even more dangerous friend. Despite my opinion of Obama, I do believe he would hit Iran--and he'd be entirely right in doing so.

You've been trying to paint Romney as a warmonger. Yet you give a pass to Obama, who has continued Bush's policies in many places, including accelerated drone strikes and more troops in Afghanistan. You can't have both. Either Obama was wrong to follow Bush's policies, or Obama's every bit the warmonger as Romney.

The Arabs and Iran's leadership hates us because we exist. Not because of some stupid video, and not because of Bush. They hate us because we exist. If you think that reelecting Obama (or for that matter, electing Romney) is going to change that, you are tragically wrong.

One last thing about Romney's statement: I don't actually think that the voters who are living off the dole will get off the sofa long enough to vote.

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#173 User is offline   minecraftsmurf 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:07 AM

View PostYoungBirdcall, on 18 September 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

I'll say it again, since no one seems to bother with pesky things like "facts" - these "dependent people" you speak of are predominantly Republicans. "The ten states with the highest number of non-[federal income tax]-payers are a strongly Republican bunch: eight of them went for John McCain in 2008, and nine of them have Republican governors." - Ramesh Panaru, a widely read conservative pundit.

Furthermore: Here Is Why Mitt (and the rest of you) Is (are) Wrong on the 47%

From the article: "More than one-fifth of Romney's "moocher 47%" are elderly: people who pay no income taxes because their income takes the form of Social Security - many, [many] of those people are Republican voters. And as Ezra Klein pointed out, more than 60% of the 47% pay payroll taxes. At 15.3%, the payroll tax rate represents a higher rate of tax than that paid by Mitt Romney himself. Only about one-fifth of taxpayers are non-elderly people who pay no [federal income] tax at all, and they are paying no tax mostly because they are unemployed in the worst economic crisis since the 1930s."

And for the record, MineCraftSmurf, you sound like Ayn Rand, and that is not a compliment.


lol, most of the individuals outside of the cities are conservative... however cities have a higher population... and therefore, represent the 47% of 'representatives' who will vote liberal regardless of who is running for president... because they are 'dependent' on government funding to run all of their unionized programs.

#174 User is offline   XenoBlade 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:31 AM

View Postminecraftsmurf, on 18 September 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

Idk, I agree 100% with Romney's remark about the 47%. They are dependent people... no real desire (motivation), or personal satisfaction to step up and deal with reality... they would rather be coddled and be told everything is rainbows. But guess what... they are not entitled to a satisfactory lifestyle on the governments dime. Eventually, regardless of who is president... the funds will not always be there. Natural Selection.


Instead of editing, ill reply here. I just love how you (and DS to an extent) believe that all those people are unmotivated or just want hand outs. (Yeah some do, but ALL. Such an assumption is folly. And untrue. You love using liberal this, and liberal that, however that such view is conservative drivel. (And Natural Selection? Please, don't equate greed to survival of the fittest. Not to mention we aren't uncivilized creatures. Do we live by the same standards as wildlife? If you want natural selection, why not let rape and murder happen. Obviously we don't want that. Having more money doesn't make anyone better. (Which reminds me, religious conservatives are huge hypocrites. If you want to be frank, Jesus would be socialist. Not giving to the rich in hopes they help the poor. That always annoyed me.) Have you attendes college? Did you apply for a pell grant? Did you accept it? I would hope not. Wouldn't want to take a hand out now would you?

Seriously, so nonchalantly deciding every non tax paying person is ridiculous. Stereotypes and racism doesn't follow to far behind such ideologies
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#175 User is offline   sentinel28a 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:39 AM

The thing of it is, if a good portion of that 47% are Republicans, then this is the biggest non-story since Palin's e-mails.

Republicans are going to vote for Romney. Many Republicans don't like Romney, or don't think he's the candidate they would've chosen (you'd be surprised how many wanted Palin). But they're going to vote for him. Why? Because they hate Barack Obama's policies. The GOP could've nominated Gendo Ikari on a platform of kicking Shinji to stimulate the economy and sending Asuka to clear up the Middle East (wait, that's not a bad idea...), and you know something? Republicans would still vote for Gendo because he's not Obama.

Me personally, I consider myself an independent. I've already said why I'm voting for Romney, but that doesn't mean I'm straight party-lining Republicans. If a Democrat says something I like, I'll vote for him. There's some things in Romney's platform I'm not insane about--for instance, his stance on gay marriage, which I support. But since the alternative is voting for Obama--who I disagree with most of the time--then I'll hold my nose and vote for Mitt. A lot of people feel the same way; some of them may be Democrats.

With this in mind, it's not very likely that people who are actually Republicans (rather than those who play them in campaign ads) will read Romney's words and say, "Hot dammit, that rich SOB just insulted me! Screw him! I'm voting for Obama!" Independents might (which is bad news for Romney, granted). But Republicans? Not likely.

What's interesting is how tight this race is. If economic factors alone decided elections, Romney should be mopping the floor with Obama. Given the advantages Obama has (likeability, being an incumbent, a media in the tank for him), he should be mopping up Romney! Instead the race is a virtual tie. Very interesting...

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This post has been edited by sentinel28a: 19 September 2012 - 01:41 AM

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#176 User is offline   minecraftsmurf 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 01:55 AM

View Postsentinel28a, on 19 September 2012 - 01:39 AM, said:

The thing of it is, if a good portion of that 47% are Republicans, then this is the biggest non-story since Palin's e-mails.

Republicans are going to vote for Romney. Many Republicans don't like Romney, or don't think he's the candidate they would've chosen (you'd be surprised how many wanted Palin). But they're going to vote for him. Why? Because they hate Barack Obama's policies. The GOP could've nominated Gendo Ikari on a platform of kicking Shinji to stimulate the economy and sending Asuka to clear up the Middle East (wait, that's not a bad idea...), and you know something? Republicans would still vote for Gendo because he's not Obama.

Me personally, I consider myself an independent. I've already said why I'm voting for Romney, but that doesn't mean I'm straight party-lining Republicans. If a Democrat says something I like, I'll vote for him. There's some things in Romney's platform I'm not insane about--for instance, his stance on gay marriage, which I support. But since the alternative is voting for Obama--who I disagree with most of the time--then I'll hold my nose and vote for Mitt. A lot of people feel the same way; some of them may be Democrats.

With this in mind, it's not very likely that people who are actually Republicans (rather than those who play them in campaign ads) will read Romney's words and say, "Hot dammit, that rich SOB just insulted me! Screw him! I'm voting for Obama!" Independents might (which is bad news for Romney, granted). But Republicans? Not likely.

What's interesting is how tight this race is. If economic factors alone decided elections, Romney should be mopping the floor with Obama. Given the advantages Obama has (likeability, being an incumbent, a media in the tank for him), he should be mopping up Romney! Instead the race is a virtual tie. Very interesting...

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This is true. Chris Christie was my first choice and Scott Walker was my second choice!

The tides have changed. I am more worried about the economy than I am about Mitt Romney being a Mormon. I am more worried about Obama revealing his extremist policies if re-elected (2nd term, no reason to hold back) than I am about Mitt Romney’s taxes. We cannot afford to continue down the same path.

#177 User is offline   minecraftsmurf 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 02:00 AM

I don’t know how you guys were raised… however, in my world, if you desired to obtain something be it money or respect, you had to put forth the necessary amount of effort to achieve it.

I don’t understand… why some individuals put forth so much effort to defend the members of the ‘emerging’ generation who undeniably lack motivation and accountability for their actions. The ‘entitled’ generation… where a fair standard of living should be provided by the government and funded by the successful. Do these defenders really feel that they are aiding them by defending their obviously ignorant ideals?

Everybody just wants to look in a different direction, pretending to be oblivious to the decadence that is brewing all around them. Guess what… it’s time to wake up… the generations following this ‘entitled’ generation will follow down the same path. What happens when the programs that keep these people afloat no longer have funding? When the majority of the population is part of the ‘entitled’ generation?

But it’s okay… Obama will save us all.

#178 User is offline   XenoBlade 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 02:30 AM

View Postminecraftsmurf, on 19 September 2012 - 02:00 AM, said:

I don’t know how you guys were raised… however, in my world, if you desired to obtain something be it money or respect, you had to put forth the necessary amount of effort to achieve it.

I don’t understand… why some individuals put forth so much effort to defend the members of the ‘emerging’ generation who undeniably lack motivation and accountability for their actions. The ‘entitled’ generation… where a fair standard of living should be provided by the government and funded by the successful. Do these defenders really feel that they are aiding them by defending their obviously ignorant ideals?

Everybody just wants to look in a different direction, pretending to be oblivious to the decadence that is brewing all around them. Guess what… it’s time to wake up… the generations following this ‘entitled’ generation will follow down the same path. What happens when the programs that keep these people afloat no longer have funding? When the majority of the population is part of the ‘entitled’ generation?

But it’s okay… Obama will save us all.


Just so you know, i hate depending on anyone. Heck, i feel weird even getting presents. But when we can't help our fellow mqlan, we might as well be savage animals. Im not rich, but I have no qualms giving food or whatnot to the homeless. Ive done it before and will gladly do it again. I don't believe we should ever make someone's life plush, but we ahould assist someone so they can make it on their own. If the trickle down system wasn't a horrible joke, I could see the argument to why people defend rich tax cuts. But alas, the trickle down sucks.

Also don't just regurgitate what you said. I want answers from you. Im curious to things ive brought up to you.
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#179 User is offline   Dark Stranger 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 04:31 AM

View PostXenoBlade, on 19 September 2012 - 01:31 AM, said:

Instead of editing, ill reply here. I just love how you (and DS to an extent) believe that all those people are unmotivated or just want hand outs. (Yeah some do, but ALL. Such an assumption is folly. And untrue. You love using liberal this, and liberal that, however that such view is conservative drivel. (And Natural Selection? Please, don't equate greed to survival of the fittest. Not to mention we aren't uncivilized creatures. Do we live by the same standards as wildlife? If you want natural selection, why not let rape and murder happen. Obviously we don't want that. Having more money doesn't make anyone better. (Which reminds me, religious conservatives are huge hypocrites. If you want to be frank, Jesus would be socialist. Not giving to the rich in hopes they help the poor. That always annoyed me.) Have you attendes college? Did you apply for a pell grant? Did you accept it? I would hope not. Wouldn't want to take a hand out now would you?

Seriously, so nonchalantly deciding every non tax paying person is ridiculous. Stereotypes and racism doesn't follow to far behind such ideologies

They are not ALL asking for handouts no. However they also still agree with the bigger group that wants more goverment control over everything. And thier hope is more goverment control=more goverment money for them. Take someone living off the goverment dollar and have him talk to a big union worker. One person works and pays taxes and is proabably a nice guy all around. The other is a leech of what is suppose to be a helping hand for troubled people, however I'm almost 100% positive they will have the same view points and vote for the same person. Why is that? Because they both are in bed with big goverment and will vote for the person who will continue to throw them bones.

Let's talk about something else while I'm at it. Though this doesn't have anything to do with the above comment. Most liberals are all about green energy and how we should push for it more, and it's better, etc. etc. Now I'm not gonna bash green energy, I do see it's upsides. However, these same people who praise one form of energy, bash another. They hate the privite coal/oil industries, mostly for getting so many tax exempetions and other things from the goverment. They calim they are too greedy and our doing all sorts of horriable things. Yet they want to turn right around and have goverment try to make green energy the main source for everything by offering the same thing (tax exemptions and the like) yet they don't think that the green energy busniessess set up by goverment won't continue to get more handouts from them and continue to be just as greedy? It's the same thing, you've just swapped out who's getting the money.
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#180 User is offline   XenoBlade 

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 08:45 AM

ill get to your reply when im free at work, tho I wanna address your question about Clinton and his surplus. It's not our debt he took care of (that will always exist. We've had debt for a while. Many years. When I just posted Reagan and Bush the 1st, I was just proving a point) its the amount of money we use compared what we make via cuts or just earning (via tax) so he had a surplus, meaning he was reducing the debt. Reagan, Bush all were in the red. Clinton in the black, and Bush 2 back in the red.
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