[HellHawk]

please watch this and share it maybe its something that matters in this world.

Ordo, Inc. Anti-Bullying Vidoe

This post has been edited by HellHawk: 23 May 2012 - 10:30 PM

[Nikku]

The issue with bullying is that the way the "rules" work is that Say your the target of bullying. If you even push back YOUR the one starting the fight and get suspended for a week or worse while the bully gets away scott free. So i'd rather we go back to the 50's rules where you push the nerd like me and he finally snaps, beats the ever living hell out of the bully and live goes on. THis "zero tolerance" crap is a rule that only helps the bullies get away with it.

[Jang Hee Joon]

.

This post has been edited by Jang Hee Joon: 15 August 2012 - 07:22 AM

[Rori]

Nikku, on 24 May 2012 - 01:29 PM, said:

The issue with bullying is that the way the "rules" work is that Say your the target of bullying. If you even push back YOUR the one starting the fight and get suspended for a week or worse while the bully gets away scott free.

This is pretty much what happened in Indy several weeks ago. Its a really hot topic right now.

Arsenal Tech expels bullied teen who carried stun gun
Pretty much... an openly gay student who was being bullied brought a stun gun to school to scare away six other students who said they were going to beat him up. The school system has acknowledged that both the bullying and the stun gun were against school rules, but the policy involving stun guns essentially has the harsher punishment. The mother of the bullied (and now expelled) student claims she brought the issue up with administrators but only got a lukewarm response.

You could argue it either way until you are blue in the face, but its just sad this is the only way this kid could send a clear message to the bullies (and the school) that it was a problem.

This post has been edited by Rori: 24 May 2012 - 05:11 PM

[The Fujoshi]

There's also the issue of beating people's behinds and then people just think of it as a challenge.

I snapped in my junior year and got into a fight with three girls who thought that since I never talked and like anime that they were above me. I ignored them but when they started throwing objects I had enough. Even after the fact they still messed with me.

I ended up throwing a music stand and basically did a Shizuo at this guy who literally talked down on me and after I ignored him for 30 minutes pulled my GBA cart right out and threw it, (why did I have a GBA at school? See below.)

Mind you we had no teacher both incidents because the teacher we had was sick due to kidney issues and the school was too lazy to find a sub/get a guard to watch a bunch of teens for about one hour. So it was free period and the kids would run amok, except for me. I ended up bringing my GBA and playing Pokemon Red/Advance wars until said incident happened.

I also defended a friend who was constantly assaulted by people and even got into fights for him. Not only did they still mess with him, but they ended up bullying me as well.

So you either stand up and they back down or you stand up and still get your butt handed to you since "oh they finally got your attention now."

This post has been edited by The Fujoshi: 24 May 2012 - 06:14 PM

[HellHawk]

Yeah guys its sad that's why me an my team are making a stand and trying to help other end bullying one step at a time, right now i'm dealing with a case of a guy on Skype bullying girls of ages 14 to 19 into doing stuff on cam by saying he will do this if you don't do this bullies can in all forums and types.

[Dark Stranger]

Honestly I'm kinda inbetween on this issue. I was bullied and made fun of alot in school. So I know it's sucky. However, once I snapped more then once and started standing up for myself (namley pummeling someone with a science textbook during lunch) it became less of a problem. Espcially my last two years in school. And I know it might sound weird but I think that it actually helped shape how I am today. It took some time to get where I am attiude wise but that was definitly a turning point for me. It helped start building my thicker skin. Not caring about what people say or do. Would I still be as blunt, opinionated, confidant, and in your face as I am today if there was no bullying? Idk, I don't think so.

[HellHawk]

Dark Stranger, on 25 May 2012 - 01:42 AM, said:

Honestly I'm kinda inbetween on this issue. I was bullied and made fun of alot in school. So I know it's sucky. However, once I snapped more then once and started standing up for myself (namley pummeling someone with a science textbook during lunch) it became less of a problem. Espcially my last two years in school. And I know it might sound weird but I think that it actually helped shape how I am today. It took some time to get where I am attiude wise but that was definitly a turning point for me. It helped start building my thicker skin. Not caring about what people say or do. Would I still be as blunt, opinionated, confidant, and in your face as I am today if there was no bullying? Idk, I don't think so.

But what about when it doesn't help shape a person and makes them self harm or take they own life?

[Dark Stranger]

HellHawk, on 30 May 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

But what about when it doesn't help shape a person and makes them self harm or take they own life?

Well, I did that too. (the first thing course, not the second one.) That's another thing that i honestly wouldn't change in my life.

I guess my point is alot of the "bullying" that I see portaryed in "big" news stories alot of the time has to deal with stuff almost always NOT happening at school. Not actually happening to a persons face. So part of me says, "wow, everyone is a bunch of crybabies. Just shut off your computer or delete those people messesging you." However, since my family didn't get a computer til I was like 16 (so after 2001), I'll admit that I can't really idendify with alot of youth (god I feel old). And I'm not into this whole "broadcast your whole life on the interent thing!" that everyone does.

I know there are such stories where that's not the case, like that one gay college kid killing himself after being secretly recorded and broadcasted. But alot of the time I hear these stories just shrug it off and say, "yeah, school sucked. Been there. Push through it." I know it might sound cold to some, but I if I could talk to these kids I would say, look at what's happened. This can only be a bad thing in your life if you let it become something negative. Turn this around, piss off the people doing this to do and make yourself stronger by it."

[Jang Hee Joon]

.

This post has been edited by Jang Hee Joon: 15 August 2012 - 07:23 AM

[The Fujoshi]

Jang Hee Joon, on 31 May 2012 - 02:45 AM, said:

Definitely agreeing with what you said there. I, too, cut myself and even attempted to kill myself a couple of times because of the bullying. This isn't a "oh woe is me, I need attention" post, because it's a very real problem that hits a little too close to home. My arms look like I've been through a bunch of sword/knife fights. I'd always have to wear long sleeves to cover up what I've been doing, so no one would notice how much of a problem it was. When I was younger, a subject like this would've had me back off into a corner, with my mouth shut. After high school, I pretty much said F-this.



The kids that are posting things on the interwebs now have a great tool to get their word out about this very sensitive subject, although it's a much different world now compared to us 20-somethings. The older generation certainly had to of had their share of hell, and it just keeps going. For some of the cases of recent bullying being posted on the internet, I really have agree with you there about "been there, done that" as well. If these kids can manage to channel this energy, it'd be great. They'd be unstoppable in anything they enjoy doing in the future.

The problem is that sometimes you can't channel your energy or you have a more serious issue than that along with the fact that human beings are self centered.

When people get depressed it's not easy to just "move on." They have to realize the change or issue themselves and it's usually too late. They may be abused at home in whatever fashion and may not have the extra boost to move on or it may be a case of low self esteem/rape. In their eyes they are seen as a "freak or nothing to society," and killing themselves off may seem like the best solution, even though it's not.

For some reason this happens more to girls than guys. I talked to a lot of men and women, teenagers and 20 year olds, so it's also the older generation, and one girl wanted to kill herself because she:

1) Her bf broke up with her

2) She was spoiled and felt that her brother was getting more so than her and that her parents didn't respect her no matter what she did because she was the oldest.

I tried to point out how she wasn't pregnant, how she was still in college, how she had a path in life, and how she had the internet to go play online games like gaiaonline. She was still stuck on her "woe is me," mode for a long time so I gave up. She also complained how shy she was even though she was a straight up elist cynical extroverted person.

Also there are the people who are attention promiscuous women that want to kill themselves. So it's hard for me to figure out who is who and actually help/care.

This song is basically how I feel and oh boy do people get mad.:

Well then!!!

This post has been edited by The Fujoshi: 01 June 2012 - 01:11 PM

[Jang Hee Joon]

.

This post has been edited by Jang Hee Joon: 15 August 2012 - 07:23 AM

[KirbyFanOne]

The Fujoshi, on 01 June 2012 - 01:07 PM, said:

Well then!!!

This song reminds me of someone... Posts on the FB pages a lot...

[The Fujoshi]

KirbyFanOne, on 01 June 2012 - 09:53 PM, said:

This song reminds me of someone... Posts on the FB pages a lot...

Sadly this song reminds me of a lot of people who play MMO games.

The other day someone shouted in the channel I was playing that they wanted to die and I basically said what was in the song. They went "LOL F you, people care about me and pmed me what's wrong with you I was just kidding, etc."

Every day desire for pity without accomplishment = attention = you want attention = you're an attention promiscuous woman if you KEEP ON DOING IT for no reason.

If you don't see that then you need to be on medication or you need help. If life gets to this point from being bullied or other means then you need to change it around. Not try to get attention or kill yourself or smoother yourself in pity.

This post has been edited by The Fujoshi: 02 June 2012 - 08:39 AM

[minecraftsmurf]

Blame the school, the teachers, the other kids, the bully, the neighbors dog and aliens... but never the parents of the alleged 'victim.'

[Dark Stranger]

minecraftsmurf, on 02 June 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

Blame the school, the teachers, the other kids, the bully, the neighbors dog and aliens... but never the parents of the alleged 'victim.'

My parents didn't have really any fault for what happened to me at school. They were always under the impression that bullies would leave you alone once you ignored them long enough. I know/knew they were wrong but I also knew that they came from a different time and didnt' understand. And they also were still supportive of me and didn't want me getting into alot of trouble at school by getting violent. (even though I sorta did).

So I'm not quite sure what the statment is suggesting. Yes there is a lot of horriable parenting going on now, but I haven't really personally seen a victim of bullying where it's the parents fault. (haven't really looked for those kinds of stories though). Or are you saying that it's the parents fault for not stepping in and getting into the matter themselves?

[HellHawk]

I have to say, Yes some time removing the people from you online life works but what if you are being bullied by someone that is a so called "hacker" and what if they know there stuff you know. I have had to deal with hackers and Cyber-bullies a lot by being a online anti bullying group and people have come to me asking me what to do about whats happening to them and i tell them, one be smart if you don't know someone that well don't go adding them on FB and Skype and all that jazz, two don't go showing body part online in any chat room at all, three just cause someone says they will do something to you if you don't do what they ask online doesn't always mean they will do it you always can just get out the chat room if you haven't gave them any info about you and four so everyone is whom they seen to be online, only are hand full of people are.

But school bullying that's real stuff right there and it turns into Cyber-bullying in some cases and yeah i have to say blame the school some time but then you have to look at the home life and blame the mum or da for whats going on if they know.

This post has been edited by HellHawk: 03 June 2012 - 07:33 PM

[Dark Stranger]

HellHawk, on 03 June 2012 - 07:32 PM, said:

I have to say, Yes some time removing the people from you online life works but what if you are being bullied by someone that is a so called "hacker" and what if they know there stuff you know. I have had to deal with hackers and Cyber-bullies a lot by being a online anti bullying group.

Ick. Well that sucks man.

[The Fujoshi]

HellHawk, on 03 June 2012 - 07:32 PM, said:

I have to say, Yes some time removing the people from you online life works but what if you are being bullied by someone that is a so called "hacker" and what if they know there stuff you know. I have had to deal with hackers and Cyber-bullies a lot by being a online anti bullying group and people have come to me asking me what to do about whats happening to them and i tell them, one be smart if you don't know someone that well don't go adding them on FB and Skype and all that jazz, two don't go showing body part online in any chat room at all, three just cause someone says they will do something to you if you don't do what they ask online doesn't always mean they will do it you always can just get out the chat room if you haven't gave them any info about you and four so everyone is whom they seen to be online, only are hand full of people are.

But school bullying that's real stuff right there and it turns into Cyber-bullying in some cases and yeah i have to say blame the school some time but then you have to look at the home life and blame the mum or da for whats going on if they know.

I posted this a long time ago:

Do not use facebook at all or make a fake one. If you do make a fake one put nothing but fake information, birthday, etc. Jobs now check Facebook accounts.

Don't post any pictures online EVER of yourself unless you want to deal with the backlash of it.

Don't use Skype unless it's family and don't add anyone.

Don't download or install anything from Superrewards or other gaming sites; it's full of spywear/trojans/viruses.

Don't post on 4chan or start troll threads.

Don't cyber or webcam ever.

Don't RP on forum sites unless it's with a friend you know and even then you are at risk.

Don't post personal information on something that can be easily accessed, such as Yahoo, Google, Facebook, Gaiaonline, etc.

Do not post your email on something that can be easily accessed, etc. etc.

If you get a strange email delete it

Update your virus/blocker/anti trojan, etc.

Use Firefox/Opera/Safari only unless you REALLY need to use IE.

Have your pop up blocker to the max.

Use Anti scripts and don't download weird scripts.

If someone is a hacker that means your computer is open/backdoored/etc. and they installed something onto your harddrive. You need to get your computer to a shop or clean it out yourself.

Use CCleaner on a daily basis.

You be surprised on how many people don't do these things. I had to tell this girl five times about CCleaner, because her computer was backlogged.

[Washu Takahashi]

I think more kids need to grow a backbone. I didn't really get picked on because when I started to get picked on, I reported it and teachers dealt with it accordingly. I was known as a bit of a snitch, but if that's what it takes to get through high school hassle free, fine by me! I still had plenty of friends and no one messed with me. (I'm not some tough macho chick or anything...quite the opposite really. But kids don't mess with you when the teachers are on your side) I once had a horrible bowling coach (through school) who didn't know the first thing about the game. So when she said something wrong, I corrected her. Needless to say, even though I was helping the others on the team to perform better, she didn't like that. She started picking on me and got some of the people on my team to do the same. Really? A grown 40-something year old woman picking on a 16 year old? Grow up. I told my mother, who called up the school, got a meeting with the athletic director, and b!tched the coach out left and right. My mother taught me from an early age I could tell her anything and not to put up with anyone's crap. Once a girl who constantly picked on me threatened to beat me up. I told her go ahead, she'd be the one suspended from school for it, not me. I was really scared she was actually going to do it at first, but she backed off, not wanting to get herself in trouble (said girl was one of the previously mentioned coach's lackeys and three times my size.)

minecraftsmurf, on 02 June 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

Blame the school, the teachers, the other kids, the bully, the neighbors dog and aliens... but never the parents of the alleged 'victim.'

I can see what your point is here. Like in my story above, I was raised to not take any crap from bullies and to stand up for myself. A lot of kids nowadays are afraid to stick up for themselves and they need to be able to talk to their parents and their parents need to believe them that these are serious issues, even when they seem small. HOWEVER, I'd say it'd be much more productive to look at the bully's parents than to look at the victim's parents.

This post has been edited by Washu Takahashi: 04 June 2012 - 10:27 AM

[HellHawk]

The Fujoshi, on 04 June 2012 - 01:06 AM, said:

I posted this a long time ago:

Do not use facebook at all or make a fake one. If you do make a fake one put nothing but fake information, birthday, etc. Jobs now check Facebook accounts.

Don't post any pictures online EVER of yourself unless you want to deal with the backlash of it.

Don't use Skype unless it's family and don't add anyone.

Don't download or install anything from Superrewards or other gaming sites; it's full of spywear/trojans/viruses.

Don't post on 4chan or start troll threads.

Don't cyber or webcam ever.

Don't RP on forum sites unless it's with a friend you know and even then you are at risk.

Don't post personal information on something that can be easily accessed, such as Yahoo, Google, Facebook, Gaiaonline, etc.

Do not post your email on something that can be easily accessed, etc. etc.

If you get a strange email delete it

Update your virus/blocker/anti trojan, etc.

Use Firefox/Opera/Safari only unless you REALLY need to use IE.

Have your pop up blocker to the max.

Use Anti scripts and don't download weird scripts.

If someone is a hacker that means your computer is open/backdoored/etc. and they installed something onto your harddrive. You need to get your computer to a shop or clean it out yourself.

Use CCleaner on a daily basis.

You be surprised on how many people don't do these things. I had to tell this girl five times about CCleaner, because her computer was backlogged.

I'm a bit late but I don't get hacked, thing is people only say they will I don't share files with people I don't know and all that good stuff. I do keep the PC clean and I don't need to hide from people cause when it comes down to the internet I don't use it for trolling, "cyber", or anything "bad" I just come on here, use Facebook, I run my website, and hang out with friends in Stickam that's about it really and I know what sites are safe and what sites aren't so yeah I just let them run their mouth.

But schools, teachers and home life make bullies but I think that the bully needs help to so they can become a better person.

[The Fujoshi]

HellHawk, on 30 June 2012 - 08:17 PM, said:

I'm a bit late but I don't get hacked, thing is people only say they will I don't share files with people I don't know and all that good stuff. I do keep the PC clean and I don't need to hide from people cause when it comes down to the internet I don't use it for trolling, "cyber", or anything "bad" I just come on here, use Facebook, I run my website, and hang out with friends in Stickam that's about it really and I know what sites are safe and what sites aren't so yeah I just let them run their mouth.

But schools, teachers and home life make bullies but I think that the bully needs help to so they can become a better person.

Some of the things mentioned is from internet trolls and bullies. Someone has a facebook and add tons of people and run into someone who is really bored and managed to find that picture you accidentally upload and forgot and BAM.

My list sounds strict but it's better to be safe than sorry.

It depends on the person and situation. Some bullies are due to the parents themselves and some are because of needed attention/abuse/medication/etc. Some bully to fit in because of low self esteem.

No matter what age there are bullies but many of them steam from high school, which is an important development point.

[HellHawk]

The Fujoshi, on 02 July 2012 - 10:05 PM, said:

It depends on the person and situation. Some bullies are due to the parents themselves and some are because of needed attention/abuse/medication/etc. Some bully to fit in because of low self esteem.

No matter what age there are bullies but many of them steam from high school, which is an important development point.

I have to agree with you low self esteem plays a lot in the making of a bully as well as needed attention/abuse/medication/etc. some people all have the need to fit in and some can just stand out with pride cause they have learned to be strong and lead. This is why i say help the bully to so they get hat help they need to be a nice/better person to other around them and it helps them have a bit of self-respect too.

[minecraftsmurf]

'Bully' in it's essence is a vague term. What defines a bully?

Dictionary.com: "a blustering, quarrelsome, overbearing person who habitually badgers and intimidates smaller or weaker people."

I have spent nearly two hours typing and deleting everything I type as I am finding it very difficult to water down my real opinion enough to prevent it from 'offending' someone.

I guess it's best to remain quite. And it's pointless to even post this. However, I have a hunch, that there are others out there that feel the same was as I. All I can say, as I am too tired to continue brain storming, is that our society is trying to breed a 'protected' generation that is going to Fail when they realize that the real world... is not all fun and games nor is it 'protected.'

[sentinel28a]

minecraftsmurf, on 06 July 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

All I can say, as I am too tired to continue brain storming, is that our society is trying to breed a 'protected' generation that is going to Fail when they realize that the real world... is not all fun and games nor is it 'protected.'

I have to agree, and we're already seeing the results of it. We try too hard to be nice with other nations who have only one goal: to bring us down. As a result, while we sit there and try and play by the rules, they're getting ready to kick us in the crotch. I'm no warmonger, but I've noticed that having half the world terrified of what you're going to do has a way of preventing wars. To quote Alfred, there are some men who just want to watch the world burn.

Not just limited in politics, either. We see it in business ("too big to fail") and in school. Every semester, I will fail 6-8 students. You can set your watch by it. Why? Because they expect to just be able to show up and get an A for doing so. When they realize that's not how college works, they drop out. They don't even want to try. A few will respond to a good verbal or metaphorical butt-kicking; the others will just run away like cowards.

(I'm not referring to the people who realize college is not for them--the ones who try, at least. Those are smart people and I want to help them. I'm referring to the lazy jerks.)

In that vein, bullies need to be kicked in the butt a few times. There are some people who only respond to force and the willingness to use it. I snapped and shoved a bully into a window in 8th grade; we were good buddies by 10th grade. Granted, we both did a lot of growing up in two years, but some people need to be reminded that the volcanoes that are the most quiet are the ones that erupt with the most force.

Ben Da Mad Irishman
"Do or do not"

[HellHawk]

minecraftsmurf, on 06 July 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

All I can say, as I am too tired to continue brain storming, is that our society is trying to breed a 'protected' generation that is going to Fail when they realize that the real world... is not all fun and games nor is it 'protected.'

Well now that why you help the bully to, well that's what I try to do and I do a very good job at it cause its not all fun and games but that is what you have to make any person see and I don't think is as much of "protecting" I think it more or less making people see whats going on around then and getting them to walk in each others shoes.

[minecraftsmurf]

HellHawk, on 09 July 2012 - 05:54 PM, said:

Well now that why you help the bully to, well that's what I try to do and I do a very good job at it cause its not all fun and games but that is what you have to make any person see and I don't think is as much of "protecting" I think it more or less making people see whats going on around then and getting them to walk in each others shoes.

From what I have seen, in many cases, it's the alleged bully who wears the more forsaken shoes compared to the alleged 'victim.'

[Dark Stranger]

What I wonder is, while bullying has always been around (some had it worse then others like me of course) why is it that these sorts of anti-bullying campaigns are all coming out now along with the whole, "don't keep score in sports", "get rid of competitive sports in school", "no students gets held back or failed", and all the other crappy campaigns going on. Now I'm not saying these people don't care about actual bullying or aren't commetted to stoping pain like I went through in school, but it seems that when you put in all these sorts of campaigns together it seems like about stopping bullying and more about "not having anyones feelings hurt". Which is all know doesn't mean squat in real life. I'm not saying it's some sort of big conspiracy but it does seem that this sort of thing will not be as affective while crap like that is going on in schools now.

[The Fujoshi]

minecraftsmurf, on 06 July 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

All I can say, as I am too tired to continue brain storming, is that our society is trying to breed a 'protected' generation that is going to Fail when they realize that the real world... is not all fun and games nor is it 'protected.'

You remember a time period (I'm not sure because of your age,) that if you did something in school you was beat down in the school by the teacher and then your parents later on? That you respect your elders and in turn they respected you? That other people could whoop your kids if they acted up and you was whooped by your own parents later on?

Now it's different because of people. Because of sex offenders in your own family, you can't trust your uncle your aunt, not even your husband because they might molest your daughter or even your son. Because of people abusing kids, you can't even whoop your own kid in this state without going to jail. People don't want you to be "touching their kids," but it's fine for them to do whatever you want while they sit there and watch?

When I was younger I was jumped on by four kids in the girl's washroom, beat down til my face was blue, and had about 25-50 dollars stolen from me for a school trip. Now when I told the teacher they did nothing; the principle did nothing. Even when my parents came up there the bully's parents just comment that I deserved it for being a "weak nerd." Mind you I fought back but guess what? They still messed with me and consider me weird just because I wasn't into rap and I drew. I ended up changing schools.

This generation is sad. You can't go into school without worrying about being shot at among other things. Parents are not "protecting," they are just getting lazy and more self centered and selfish because of the times. If you use a video game to watch your kids and then complain how the game is influencing your kid then you have a problem.

I don't agree with you Sent. This country just has issues and it's a culture thing. There is nothing wrong with helping people.

The problem is that parents are raising kids in ignorance and in turn the kids are doing whatever they want and when they become adults they either get spoiled, stupid, selfish, or just plan "children with adult bodies." If you are 50 something years old and you think the only way you can live in life is by using men for money and you shouldn't work, then there was some issues with your parents there.

Many parents use the school to raise them until they 'touch,' the kid, then they go off about their baby and what not. They send them off so they can smoke weed, use drugs, whatever or they use some other influence like tv or video games.

Beating the people bulling you butts doesn't work 100%; they could just shoot you after school. You was lucky; I remember this girl in high school that did try to shoot me and my friend with a gun when I tried to defend myself and him. No matter what I did the bullies loved to pick on me until I exploded. They thought it was a hoot that someone who was "a quiet snob," would go off. I even threw a desk at this boy and he still messed with me. I fought with the biggest kid in my senior class and they still threw food at me. Nothing worked; I was surprised I didn't fail high school from fighting so much and/or ditching to play yugioh.

Some kids are afraid to defend themselves because they don't want to die and it's very easy to die if you fight against a bully and people simply don't trust or believe anyone anymore, not even their own children. You don't know if they have a knife or are going to stab you, shoot you, etc. It's sad because fights used were 1 vs 1 with your fights. Now it's you vs. ten of your buddies and you don't know if they have bats or golf clubs or knives or what. Then if they keep doing it you get overwhelm and when you get overwhelmed you get desperate, which is why people bring weapons and kill said bullies or themselves, or anyone that wasn't there to "help them in their mind to this breaking point." Sad thing is that it could be prevented but once again the self centered mentality!

America is a superpower; if China had the resources like us, well they would go toe to toe with us. The reason why we haven't been nuked out the water is because of this and because a few countries did and failed due to bad timing and resources. Some people are not stupid despite history. I mean seriously, who can really go against our country and win/take over? Some tried but due to economic issues they can't. But that's a different matter all together.

This post has been edited by The Fujoshi: 10 July 2012 - 08:08 PM

[sentinel28a]

Not sure where we disagree, Fujoshi, because I agree with you 100%.

Ben Da Mad Irishman
"Awesome"