[Evangelion_Unit_01]

Hello fellow Acen friends, I just wanted to take a moment to clear my head of things I see happening to Acen and how they have gotten worse each year. Especially last year....

Now I know this may cause people to troll me and/or upset them, but whatever..

I have been going to Acen for 6 years now, and been attending cons since I was 13...I am now almost 25. Im upset that Acen is becoming more of an excuse to party, underage drink, drugs, and dance scene than an Anime Convention. I mean its not called Ecstasy/Rave Central...its called ANIME CENTRAL. It's suppose to be a place where people with similar interests and hobbies such as...Anime, Manga, Games, Table top games, Collectors, Cosplaying...can all come together in one place for a f**king amazing weekend. Last year was the worst I have ever seen, I'd say at least 20-30 of the people I talked to said that they weren't even there for Anime OR EVEN THE CONVENTION!? They said they just come for the room parties and because they know IRT guys that can let them in to the Soap bubble....really people...

Cosplay also took a decrease as well...which is kinda sad considering that in years past the cosplay has been amazing and awesome. Now its just like "Hey...im gonna throw a black bed sheet on myself and say Im death from soul eater or something." Also what happened to the dealers room?? Its like 30% anime related...the rest is like gothic fashion/cyber punk rave gear. Which is really cool, but I came to look for Figurines, Anime, Manga, Plushies, Wallscrolls, and cool collectables. There were like what 12-15 tables outta that whole giant place that sold anime related products and they ALL sold the exact same items...

But I digress...now this is the first time I have ever said something bad about Acen, and I dont post stuff like this. Im really not trying to upset people with this either, but I've talked to A LOT! of people that agree with me on this so I know I'm not close to being alone. I just want the glory days of Acen back...good soap bubble music, unknown manga writers, great selection vendor hall, more cosplay, and most important- people who came to an ANIME convention TO BE at an anime convention. Come on Acen you did it FOR YEARS!! Why cant you do it now?????

If you read all of this thank you so much, and if you didn't...well...just REALLY open your eyes this next year and you will know right away what Im talking about...

Anyways by all means share your thoughts on this, this isn't me saying BUH-BYE ACEN! with my middle finger in the air. I will always support Acen and look foreword to the wonderful things they DO bring us like guests, and panels, and all the hard work with running the damn thing...I just dont understand what is happening to the con I drive 6-7 hours just to be at...

[The Fujoshi]

I wanted to say welcome back, long time no see first. You made good points and reminded me of some things this year.

It didn't seem the same. There was something missing. Sure I had bad years but not from the con in question, mostly from drama.

I remember when the soap bubble didn't have a line, when the yaoi guy with doujinshi had good doujinshi, (I was sold a Sweden/Finland instead of Russiamerica, even though he claim it was the latter this year,) when there was tons of game on display that made you go wow, etc.

The best point this year for me was going, meeting people from the forums, and not sleeping on the floor. There was a lot of drama, stupidity and signs everywhere.

The con is growing I know and everyone isn't reliable in terms of new staff, but I was wondering how would Acen get its old spark back? I know three people who are not coming back because of the rave, groping, and glomping issues. I am going to try to help this year but what do you guys think or should do or the staff do?

[Phantasmagoria]

I agree with you 50000%. Although I have failed to attend ACEN the past couple years, I can see from just hearing people's complaints that it has gone down hill. I absolutely adored going to ACEN in 2009. I felt it was full of fun, anime, and all the "real" reasons one should attend a convention in the first place. Everyone was friendly, everyone that cared knew who you were, etc. It surprised me that when a friend from college said it was really disappointing last year. Of course, this is not stopping me from going. But it pisses me off that it's apparently become party central now? I remember marveling over the magnificent cosplays people put SO much time and effort into. I cannot stand half-assed cosplays. Don't cosplay if you can't do it good. Work with the materials you have. Gosh... I hope it's not like that when I finally return next year. This worries me. I wanna hear some good news for something I've yearned to return to. It's like my home; I don't want to see morons screw it up.

Of course all this being said, this is more of a personal philosophical view. Only a few people on the forums know where I'm coming from.

This post has been edited by Phantasmagoria: 17 August 2011 - 10:10 PM

[PsychoNoble]

I recall having a loooong chat about this with you at the convention, so you know where I stand on this subject, bro!
Bottom line, I agree %100,000. I love ACen and all, but I can only hope things get better next year.

[KirbyFanOne]

I don't pay 50 dollars to go to parties and neither should anyone else.

2011 was my least favorite year due to combined factors of it not feeling fun, personal problems keeping me from having fun, and the fact it seems different, like something/one changed. Maybe I changed? Maybe I'm tired of it? Who's to say...

I'm sure a majority of people don't get hammered there, but those who do sometimes ruin it for the rest of us. I probably won't make it to the next ACen and that's probably for the best. If everything goes through I'll be out on my own at that time next year and hopefully expanding my con horizons, starting fresh with no drama, ties, or interests tying me down.

Something is rotten in Rosemont...

[Visadin the insane]

I knowpeople will be pissed at me, but i was drunk at acen for both nights but i was also only drunk in flying elf's room. the rest of thetime i was in the tabletop room and had a great time.

i say the issue is that the panals are becoming less about anime, there was a panal about batman this year.

on a brighter note, other then the bag rule, the game room was mush better then last year, there was petty mush every system and the arcade wasn't 15 DDR clones +MVC2.

This post has been edited by Visadin the insane: 17 August 2011 - 10:42 PM

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

Thanks guys, I know a lot of people here on the forums...and most of them LONG LONG time veterans of the con like myself who feel the same way we all do. Including my bro Psychonoble up there =)


But yes Kirby!....something HAS changed and I dont know what it is either. At first I thought the same thing, maybe it's me?? You know...i dont think it is, in fact im positive it's not me. Something about Acen has changed and it is upsetting a ton of people. I have a theory that it is this NEW anime generation that is causing this change. All these people that consider watching the 2 animes on adult swim every saturday is being an anime fan. Or the crazies that run around screaming, and jumping on random people going OMG A COSPLAY FROM NARUTO! Ugh...I remember when an Anime con was die hard. People who watched it and read manga like a career, and actually watched a REAL ANIME like the greats from the 90's and early 2000's. Panels and Unknown manga writers were the attraction as well as cosplay people poured their heart and soul in to. I remember when there was only like 2-3 room parties total at the convention that everyone went to...and you know what...we shared knowledge on things related to ANIME!..manga and gaming as well. Not getting drunk and talking about how your gonna smoke Soooo much weed before the soap bubble.

I just want my con back...and i want this missing piece to reappear...

[rondo]

I go to ACEN to party, to have fun, and to meet people I haven't seen in awhile. That being said, I'm also here because of anime/manga and to be around people of similar tastes. I tend to agree to an extent as I too have seen this change over the years since around 2000 for me. It seems year after year, it just feels a teeny bit less than an anime convention and more of a big dance party.

I should take this time, in honor of the upcoming 15th anniversary, to do a 10 year reflection on ACEN..based heavily on the content of the convention. Just so happens that I have my 2001 and 2011 con guides handy.

This post has been edited by rondo: 17 August 2011 - 10:42 PM

[Visadin the insane]

even though i think the con is going to heavly on the rave aspect, this post is sounding more like linkara's super boy prime level of anigts. where the young wipersnapers are killing anime and how everyone was better in the 90's.

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

rondo, on 17 August 2011 - 10:40 PM, said:

I go to ACEN to party, to have fun, and to meet people I haven't seen in awhile. That being said, I'm also here because of anime/manga and to be around people of similar tastes. I tend to agree to an extent as I too have seen this change over the years since around 2000 for me. It seems year after year, it just feels a teeny bit less than an anime convention and more of a big dance party.

I should take this time, in honor of the upcoming 15th anniversary, to do a 10 year reflection on ACEN..based heavily on the content of the convention. Just so happens that I have my 2001 and 2011 con guides handy.

HAHA That is awesome! I bet the change is very noticeable...panels wise at least

and I agree that partying is great. I drink and meet tons of people too every year...but Yes just like me you go for the REAL reason one attends an anime convention

[rondo]

Visadin the insane, on 17 August 2011 - 10:47 PM, said:

even though i think the con is going to heavly on the rave aspect, this post is sounding more like linkara's super boy prime level of anigts. where the young wipersnapers are killing anime and how everyone was better in the 90's.

[Visadin the insane]

I am not agenst ACAN being more about anime, butlet not plame this all on the new ganaration, there are people who only go there for the soap bubble and most peoplego there are more fans of video games or comic books. you can't blame this all on the new seeds.

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

Visadin the insane, on 17 August 2011 - 10:47 PM, said:

even though i think the con is going to heavly on the rave aspect, this post is sounding more like linkara's super boy prime level of anigts. where the young wipersnapers are killing anime and how everyone was better in the 90's.

Haha I suppose it could sound like that. I didnt mean it like that at all...just knowing classic anime shows is respectable is all. Having conversations about something other than Bleach, Naruto, Air Gear, and Soul Eater would be nice is all. They arent bad shows...but I wish the younger crowd would broaden their horizons a bit

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

Visadin the insane, on 17 August 2011 - 10:55 PM, said:

I am not agenst ACAN being more about anime, butlet not plame this all on the new ganaration, there are people who only go there for the soap bubble and most peoplego there are more fans of video games or comic books. you can't blame this all on the new seeds.

Believe me Im not about to start pointing fingers. That was a theory of mine only because I can physically see things happening at the cons I go to. and hey the video game crowd has/and will always be welcomed at anime cons. Thats just how it is...but American cartoons, American Comics, and other things of that nature should just not be there.

We have a con called "Convergence" here which is a Gaming, Sci'Fi, and American Comic convention...Im sure Chicago has something like that too. All im saying is...an anime/manga con...should be an anime/manga con

[Phantasmagoria]

PsychoNoble, on 17 August 2011 - 10:26 PM, said:

I recall having a loooong chat about this with you at the convention, so you know where I stand on this subject, bro!
Bottom line, I agree %100,000. I love ACen and all, but I can only hope things get better next year.

I agree 1,000,000,000% to his 100,000%

[KirbyFanOne]

Evangelion_Unit_01, on 17 August 2011 - 10:40 PM, said:

But yes Kirby!....something HAS changed and I dont know what it is either. At first I thought the same thing, maybe it's me?? You know...i dont think it is, in fact im positive it's not me. Something about Acen has changed and it is upsetting a ton of people. I have a theory that it is this NEW anime generation that is causing this change. All these people that consider watching the 2 animes on adult swim every saturday is being an anime fan. Or the crazies that run around screaming, and jumping on random people going OMG A COSPLAY FROM NARUTO! Ugh...I remember when an Anime con was die hard. People who watched it and read manga like a career, and actually watched a REAL ANIME like the greats from the 90's and early 2000's.

This is part of the problem here. The generation of anime fans that is growing up now doesn't know the Golden Age of anime and we do, so there's always going to be that generation gap. The attitude that "We were better off" is always there no matter who is in the conversation. I don't care if it's Naruto, Bleach, or whatever anime of the day it is, the scene is changing for better or for worse. I just feel that the spirit of the con is lost and it's not going to be hard to find it again. Some unpopular decisions may have to be made, but if they have to be for the bettering of the image of ACen then they need to be made.

Though the crazy can be cut back a bit.

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

But regardless...I just wanted to vent about some of my frustrations. Im not here to make enemy's because I consider most of this forum crowd to be friends and I love you all...i dont want some stupid argument or debate here. Keep posting cause I want opinions, again im not BLAMING anyone...but at the same time something has to be done to get this convention back on track IMO. Because there are REAL problems starting with it...this year is all the proof you need

This post has been edited by Evangelion_Unit_01: 17 August 2011 - 11:44 PM

[Visadin the insane]

I can live with a few comic book and people who like non anime cartoons fans roaming around peeking into showings of fullmetal alcamist or gurren lagann, hell there is now anime base off of marval heroes now. and i don't mind over branch of nerd culture like sci-fi,tabletop or hell furries.

my real beef is always the ravers, most of them care little about anime and more about the soap bubble. their most of the time on drugs and when i was next to one they smell the worst thing i smell that year, and that is saying something in a place which is infamous for it smell. the other drug and drunk people are collage kids but really i don't mind them most of them are anime fans let itbe from huge fans to "i wrash bleach on AS" and getting drunk and highon the weekend is kind of their thing since ever.

although funny thought i have a good idea for a panal about how to close the genaration gap in anime.

chicago have about 3 cons i know of that is sci-fi, comic book and horror base, and we jast had our 2nd anime con pop up last month, outside of reaction but that more ofa drunken party then acen is and ever will be, maybe the death of it kind of drag the bad seeds to acen i don't know really.

This post has been edited by Visadin the insane: 18 August 2011 - 12:28 AM

[AnimeFantasy]

This Year was my 7th ACEN, And I haven't ever attended a room party or gone anywhere near soap bubble, and ACEN to me is more fun now than when I was first going.

There are many many many different types of people at ACEN, and everyone is going to have there own likes and dislikes. the 23,000 attendees gotta come from somewhere. The dealers room was a bit different, more diverse, but that's not really a bad thing, as there's only so many current figures that people buy and that US based retailers can keep in stock that It doesn't really surprise me that there aren't 100's of figure and DVD retailers. Having those oddball stores that sell light up skulls and techno wands is kinda neat in its own way.

Maybe its because I haven't gone to the rave or gotten smashed, but ACEN to me is still the same as it was 6 years ago. My panel was at the same time as the rave and I still had a filled room, so it's not all ravers these days.

Try not staying in the Hyatt or something, down at the Mariott Suites it was quiet and comfortable.

With ACEN's 15th anniversary coming up, I have higher hopes than ever.

This post has been edited by AnimeFantasy: 18 August 2011 - 02:11 AM

[Millions_Knives]

wow this got long
but let me go over what ive done at most cons
(see what for sale and not buy any of it, go to the masquerade, and hang out with con ppl)
im sry to hear that the pixi dust has worn off on you sort of speck
like the hipster whos cool but struggling dive
is now a haven for preps and hoties looking looking for the "hot new scene"
anime cons too are the place to go to party
kind of a side effect of main stream media
or being on the edge of it to be more accurate

not to blow you minds
but this has been true for at least as long as my mom has been going to scifi cons
(~1975 but i dare not ask again due to the long rant sure to come)
once ppl broken off from their core con friends
and con drama is kept to a min
these things start getting more clear
its kind of bitter sweat


of course the natural rebuttal would be
"but small cons"
to witch i respond room parties
anime mid west and roman con are tomorrow
cant get much smaller
im hoping to pop into 3 parties but likely only two (roman con)
WOOOOO


ok so im on the boat with you guys
on not liking the drugs and crazy happenings
theres just this one flaw i have to point out here
the rest of acen
like during the day
i just had fun at the other stuff going on during the rave
(ok so some drinking may have happened i know i know)
but there is so much to do
including laughing at the ppl in line that will never get in lol



here is the thing
some ware along the line the hard core fandom
like the ppl who do this for years (cough cough)
kind of run out of stuff to do
what then just stop going?

but moving on to wishing things back the the way they were
sry my ppl i love you all
and this place we have here
but it changes
every year new ppl with new fandoms
here the good news
theres only so much new anime
harder core fans will more on
the argument of good anime to me seems a bit like the Kirk VS, Picard thing
it kinda funny b/c the scifi ppl had the same issues us anime ppl
as we are with the game ppl starting to cosplay

i cant believe i have to say this
cosplay is about the fandom
ill at least give a nod to that really bad L for trying
even it its a bit painful
winning another chunk of plastic or sheet of paper is ok
but crushing an especially pompass cosplayer is so sweet

witch brings me to the end of this torrent of hot air
for my $150-$200 cost of acen
i just want to see you guys
hang out for a time
cuzz you all are awesome
what other ppl do with their time
is up to them

theres going to be some fun times ahead
good times to all

[The Fujoshi]

AnimeFantasy: Guess it depends on the person.

Kirby: Don't feel left out. My last five Acens were like what you mention. For some reason stupidity rolls around that time period and what can go wrong did go wrong. What I did was similar to what I do at work: block out the personal issues and just look at the now. Hope to see you in 2013! If I don't get a job soon though I might not help out or go next year.

Visadin: Why don't you do that panel?

[tatterpillar]

Phantasmagoria, on 17 August 2011 - 10:08 PM, said:

I agree with you 50000%. Although I have failed to attend ACEN the past couple years, I can see from just hearing people's complaints that it has gone down hill. I absolutely adored going to ACEN in 2009. I felt it was full of fun, anime, and all the "real" reasons one should attend a convention in the first place.

2009 was my first ACen and I had a great time as well. I didn't make it this year, but it sounds like I didn't miss much

Evangelion_Unit_01, on 17 August 2011 - 10:40 PM, said:

I have a theory that it is this NEW anime generation that is causing this change. All these people that consider watching the 2 animes on adult swim every saturday is being an anime fan.../...People who watched it and read manga like a career, and actually watched a REAL ANIME like the greats from the 90's and early 2000's...

Although I empathized with everything you said in the first post, I can't get behind this one. I don't see why someone who hasn't seen the greats doesn't make him a pretend anime fan. We can't just write off the new gen. Why not enlighten them to the sweet, sweet old school stuff we grew up on? Isn't that pretty much the responsibility of each generation? Start the conversation with, "Back in my day, we walked 10 miles uphill in the snow to watch our anime.." Teasing..

But seriously, I think it may have something to do with the mainstreaming of anime these days and the ability to easily find it all around whereas "back in the day," we had to search local shops and catalogues (I'm pretty sure this is a collection of opinions regurgitated from another thread).

Millions_Knives, on 18 August 2011 - 08:27 AM, said:

i cant believe i have to say this
cosplay is about the fandom
ill at least give a nod to that really bad L for trying
even it its a bit painful
winning another chunk of plastic or sheet of paper is ok
but crushing an especially pompass cosplayer is so sweet

Well put, Sir (your entire post, actually).

[KirbyFanOne]

tatterpillar, on 18 August 2011 - 11:11 AM, said:

Well put, Sir (your entire post, actually).

Lot's of things are reflected by the fandom; The Good, Bad, And Ugly.

It's just that the first of those needs to really shine so the other two don't detract from the overall experience.

I'm not saying ravers and party animals are horrible, horrible people who need to be corralled into a pasture, but given the overall con experience and what makes them what they are, where do those fit into what Acen wants to be? It wouldn't kill me if they were downplayed, but then others would lose reason to go. It's a slippery slope.

And along with those people you get all kinds; children, man-children, elitists, knit-pickers, elder adults, people of various social classes and affluence, you name it. I will always say the way forward is mutual understanding and vanquishing of ignorance. The older and knowledgeable set need to inform the younger or more mainstream set about what is out there.

The con experience ultimately lies in the fans, much like a capitalist society runs on consumer purchases and confidence in the market. If we don't tell them what we want, how can they change their game plan to fix what needs to be addressed?

Spoiler

To circumvent any political or economical discussion I'll just say it's what is ideal, not what it actually is.

The possibility is that I could also just be burn out like I stated many times. One day I'll probably run to a con by myself and shack up with fellow attendees who will take me in (AKA accept my money) and experience a con like that. I always get irked that I have to worry about my time with others, especially how short it is at these things.

[Miss Marie]

Evangelion_Unit_01, on 17 August 2011 - 10:40 PM, said:

Something about Acen has changed and it is upsetting a ton of people. I have a theory that it is this NEW anime generation that is causing this change. All these people that consider watching the 2 animes on adult swim every saturday is being an anime fan. Or the crazies that run around screaming, and jumping on random people going OMG A COSPLAY FROM NARUTO! Ugh...I remember when an Anime con was die hard. People who watched it and read manga like a career, and actually watched a REAL ANIME like the greats from the 90's and early 2000's.

Honestly, I don't think that's a fair assessment. I don't care if an ACEN attendee only gets their anime from Adult Swim or wherever, who am I to judge? As long as they have a passion for it, that's awesome! That's the kind of people we need at this con, not just people looking for a, ummm, good time.

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

tatterpillar, on 18 August 2011 - 11:11 AM, said:

Although I empathized with everything you said in the first post, I can't get behind this one. I don't see why someone who hasn't seen the greats doesn't make him a pretend anime fan. We can't just write off the new gen. Why not enlighten them to the sweet, sweet old school stuff we grew up on? Isn't that pretty much the responsibility of each generation? Start the conversation with, "Back in my day, we walked 10 miles uphill in the snow to watch our anime.." Teasing..

But seriously, I think it may have something to do with the mainstreaming of anime these days and the ability to easily find it all around whereas "back in the day," we had to search local shops and catalogues (I'm pretty sure this is a collection of opinions regurgitated from another thread).

Hey Tatter....you know I was kind of on a rant last night because of how much was on my mind. I didnt really word my thoughts well. I totally agree with enlightening them on Anime's that started it all and ones that shaped the stories and anime's of today. Im not saying new anime fans or younger people suck in anyway, and maybe my quarrel is more with the ravers and drugies who just happen to be the new crowd. You know I do my fair share of drinking at the con and having fun with lots of random people so this isn't about people shouldn't party.

My points in the first post where what im gettin at. The change in Acen's events, vendor halls, artist alley and even the staff. Maybe if Acen would just bring back all the great panels and switch up the anime showings a bit, we could put a stop to the tons of people coming to Acen purely to dance and do drugs.

[Evangelion_Unit_01]

Your post was great knives and you made a lot of good points.

I remember sitting at a table with you, psychonoble, aikonoble, and pikachii this year...and I forget the specifics of the conversation but I know it had to do with this subject. We were pointing out things that just seemed a little....off..

[linlindesu]

Visadin the insane, on 18 August 2011 - 12:25 AM, said:

my real beef is always the ravers, most of them care little about anime and more about the soap bubble. their most of the time on drugs and when i was next to one they smell the worst thing i smell that year, and that is saying something in a place which is infamous for it smell. the other drug and drunk people are collage kids but really i don't mind them most of them are anime fans let itbe from huge fans to "i wrash bleach on AS" and getting drunk and highon the weekend is kind of their thing since ever.

Ok, I was digging this thread til I read this. I am really REALLY sick of the "Soap Bubble kidz iz teh izzue hur". Because honestly, whether you support it or not, Acen wouldn't have much anymore without the dances. People going JUST for the dances that are buying those one day badges are usually not causing any trouble because they go to the dance, enjoy themselves, then leave. Giving extra monies to MAPS considering they don't usually take part in any other activities. Getting rid of the dances will likely lead to a bunch of really bored people. Really bored people leads to a lot of them causing their own "fun". Everything from harmless room party to wrecking the hotel.

Now, here's a bit of a sad statement. Acen is officially more expensive than Anime Expo. Not considering travelling expenses, one would actually save a bit of money going to Anime Expo vs. Acen. Anime Expo may be an industry, for profit con, but it draws in major guests every single year. Hell, Sakura con has been kicking Acens' a** in the guest department for a few years now. I'm holding out for the fifteenth anniversary drawing a few major guests but I'm actually fearing disappointment. *crosses fingers*

Yes, Acen has been a party con for a while now. That may have to do with acen not really having a lot of events or good guests. People are not attending Acen for the panels, events, or seeing their favoritest jpop artist or seiyuu; People are attending to party and hear some amazing djs spin ( despite what anyone thinks of the "ravers", the Djs Acen books draw a huge crowd every year for a reason. )

[Visadin the insane]

i sleep it over and now i do see why we need a ravers, but yes we need better guest and events.

as for my panal idea, i don't know where to start with it or if i have the time, my issue is that i hate it when people go all grandpa simpson on forums and say how todays fans/video games/anime/comic book/movies, or even the people who like to just flat out say everything was better in the 80's or the 90's, which piss me off. 80's movies are really no diffent to todays, we have saw, they had friday the 13th, we have 12 "epic movie" like crap, they had about 12 police acdamey films. i also don't have time to do a panal but if someone close by chicago want to get together on wendsdays or thrsdays i be down to chuck down a panal and co produes it.

[rondo]

linlindesu, on 18 August 2011 - 01:24 PM, said:

Yes, Acen has been a party con for a while now. That may have to do with acen not really having a lot of events or good guests. People are not attending Acen for the panels, events, or seeing their favoritest jpop artist or seiyuu; People are attending to party and hear some amazing djs spin ( despite what anyone thinks of the "ravers", the Djs Acen books draw a huge crowd every year for a reason. )

I *used* to attend ACEN for the panels, events, and anime/manga related quests. Now I attend for friends and just getting away from Ohio (that Chicago food doesn't hurt either).

[The Fujoshi]

Visadin the insane, on 18 August 2011 - 03:01 PM, said:

Panel idea

I might be able to do it if I go next year, but finding a job comes first.

You have a day or timeslot in mind?