[zaps00]

Ladies and gentleman, the time has come for me to spill the beans on the arcade lineup for this year. sorry it is coming so late but we were doing our best to hold off until we had a finalized list.

Thank you once again to Nickel City in Northbrook, IL for providing the majority of the games this year. I'd also like to thank a few of my close friends for donating a few games out of their personal collections. With this being said, please respect all these games because if we find you vandalizing them the owners WILL press charges for any damages caused.

With that out of the way.... HERE WE GO!

THE ANIME CENTRAL 2006 OFFICIAL ARCADE LIST

Dance Dance Revolution 8th Mix
In The Groove 2
Guitar Freaks 11th Mix
Para Para Paradise 1st Mix Plus
DanceManiaX 2nd Mix
Pump It Up: Zero
Initial D Arcade Stage V3
Time Crisis 3
Guilty Gear SLASH
Marvel vs Capcom 2
Tekken 5
Super Puzzle Fighter 2 Turbo
Ultracade
Mortal Kombat
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: The Arcade Game
Smash TV
Ms. Pac Man

Yes the games will be pay to play, save a few of the older ones which Nickel City will be providing free of charge. Pricing will be determined shortly and posted.

As you can see, we have expanded out lineup QUITE a bit, and hopefully I'll be able to bring you another update to that in the next few days.

[june.h]

I would like to add that anyone worried about the condition of the dancing games, we're working on getting them in tip-top shape before the con. New sensors are being ordered and the monitor will be replaced on one of the machines, and they will be tested quite thoroughly for accuracy.

[Syxx]

So does that mean no console Tekken 5 in the arcade again this year?

Or Guilty Gear slash for that matter....

[dark_angel]

is ITG2 a dedicab or an upgrade?

[zaps00]

Syxx said:

So does that mean no console Tekken 5 in the arcade again this year?

Or Guilty Gear slash for that matter....

Yeah, as part of the deal with Nickel City, we will not allow any console versions of any of the arcade machines we have. The ONLY exception for this will be for tournament time. And same as last year, this will be enforced strictly.

dark_angel said:

is ITG2 a dedicab or an upgrade?

It is an upgrade, however the machine has just been reconditioned, given new pressure sensors, inspected.

[june.h]

Well, don't uptalk the machine quite yet.

The machines is being worked on by me all week, and I will be asking other players like Windeu to help judge how good the machines are for playability.

The amp board is still messed up on one side, so an alternative will be offered, but we will be working hard to get these in tournament-ready condition by ACen.

You paid your registration, you should get your money's worth =)

[Rob]

As was my complaint two years ago, it still stands today. I'll never comprehend how you're helping the attendees by bringing in pay-to-play cabs for games that work not only flawlessly, but more conveniently on consoles. Don't get me wrong, I understand some of the larger cabs for the puzzle / dance games and what-not, but even after all this time I fail to see the reasoning behind MvC2, GG:S, T5, and MK.

Ah, well, it's your game room, I'm not going to bother arguing over this business again. Shame.

For anyone interested keep your eyes open for GG:S room party fliers. =]

[Syxx]

zaps00 said:

Yeah, as part of the deal with Nickel City, we will not allow any console versions  of any of the arcade machines we have. The ONLY exception for this will be for tournament time. And same as last year, this will be enforced strictly.

That's really gay because the arcade version of Tekken 5 that nickel city has is an outdated version that no one plays (5.1). Ppl still play console version though (5.0). Is this gonna make a difference? They'd be better off not lugging the machine here. Well ppl will probably end up "borrowing" a couple tvs from the game room like last year anyway. Anyway... gay. Leave those machines at NC. =P In other words I 100% agree with the above poster.

[DaviKaze]

I don't know why this goes down with Guily Gear every year. The staffers have said over and over that they don't play GG. I don't know why then, that they would go ahead every year and have GG on cabs even though all anyone does is complain.

Pad players can't use pads, stick players can't play their sticks. Nobody likes paying money. Gulity Gear is a game that hasn't seen widespread arcade release in the states. I won't say that nobody wants to play friendlies on a cab, just that those players are in a great minority.

Of course, whatever. It's never mattered what con-goers said about this gaming room before. It won't matter now. Anyone who wants some games in on Slash console can get ahold of me.

-Davi

Edit: Wow, Tekken players are complaining too. Just leave contemporary fighters on consoles already, or at least learn to treat games on a case-by-case basis. Leave the monsters at the arcade.

[zaps00]

Quote

Well ppl will probably end up "borrowing" a couple tvs from the game room like last year anyway.

No, this will not be happening again this year. I am sorry, but I have an agreement with Nickel City that I MUST uphold.

[DaviKaze]

zaps00 said:

No, this will not be happening again this year. I am sorry, but I have an agreement with Nickel City that I MUST uphold.

Syxx said:

That's really gay

That's about the size of it.

[Jester9113]

i think i might be on that TMNT 24:7

[WickedElement]

As far as im concerned, this lineup of Arcade Games that Nickel City is bringing is not bad at all. I'd have to say that you guys are lucky to have a decent selection for Acen especially since its tough to have a successful arcade business in the US. The prices for the games would probably be no more than a quarter/token for the standard cabs and probably 2 or 3 for the racing and music games, but thats about it. Also, having maintainance at a convention is good, especially considering that there aren't too many vendors in the US now that would care enough to keep up their games. Out of experience(I used to work at an arcade in California), it is also rare to have a decent selection of games available for a convention due to many things like time constraints, space available, outlets available, contract complications, supply and demand issues. All these things come into play when having a vendor work with convention center staff, colleges, universities, parties, etc. If this selection of games doesn't entertain you, theres always the console room and/or you can always host a gaming party in a hotel room. In any case, when dealing with many people with different tastes in games, it is difficult to make everyone happy. Its a convention. There are many things to do there. Get over yourselves and just have fun.

[sinfinity]

WickedElement said:

In any case, when dealing with many people with different tastes in games, it is difficult to make everyone happy. Its a convention. There are many things to do there. Get over yourselves and just have fun.

Well said. And I can't thank you enough for being so positive.

[Syxx]

You are missing the point. Uh it's cool that they are having arcade versions of ID, DDR, Parapara and whatever but why bring fighting games that are available on console in an identical or better... and free... version?

[digimonemporer]

Forgive me, but I'm afriad that I need to be a tad direct! I understand that you staffers in the game room must keep amends with nickle city and company. But why charge gammers for games they can bring in themselves? Are you just asking for fighting videogamers to just NOT come to the game room or something. Because I see that is where this is heading. This is ACEN not the arcade, if people wanna pay to play games then they'd go to an arcade, right? I don't understand you guys' logic on wasting money for games people can just bring in.

And remember this just has to do with the fighting games. You have no-idea how many people complained to me (a regular attendee who wasn't on staff) about how lame paying to play games they already have was. That really irratated me hella!

All I'm saying if you do have arcade games bring those that aren't all-ready available to those who can bring them via console!!!

Or the people attending the game room is gonna become less and less. Til you guys just decide to not do it all together and that's gonna really suck!!!

For the record:
T5.1 is outdated and utter trash, since that will be the game from NC, I don't see how you guys can complain if people set-up T5.0 console set-ups!!!

Becuase those two are not the same game, right? Right!!!!

[DaviKaze]

It's become obvious here to me what the problem is. The staff doesn't understand what's best for competitive fighting gamers. The people who aren't into competitive fighters don't understand the problem.

Look, people who play on pads don't want to (or in most cases - cannot) play on a stick.
People who play sticks want to play on their stick.
People who play fighting games on console don't want to pay to play on an arcade cab that doesn't let them use their pad or stick.
In the case of Tekken the players are forced to pay to play an outdated game as well.

It's that simple. The game room is CHARGING us so we can have a worse time. It's been happening for years. Everything about the game room has been improving EXCEPT the fighters. This just gets worse and worse every year.

We aren't upset because of what they do or don't have on cabs. We're upset that the cabs are being FORCED on us. We don't want them, they're being forced on us, and we have to pay to play them. It sounds pretty lose/lose/lose to me.

I agree with digimonemporer, for the record. This crap keeps up and people are just going to stop playing fighting games in the aCen game room.

And I just want to point out one more time that we're being CHARGED MONEY for something inconvenient and unnecessary. Kids who play GG on pads don't even get to touch the game in the game room outside of the tourney! And if they do? They have to pay for it!!

Bravo.

EDIT: I just wanted to note that I have always, personally, thought that the cabs are crap. I remember when JPopHouse charged people to enter the SID acoustic live that the con, the con flipped out because every activity in the con is supposed to be free after the price of badge.

What's more is that every other con in the country has game rooms that run well and that people leave happy every year without dragging in fighting game cabs (and forcing them on people).

Droves of gamers walk into the aCen game room, discover that they not only don't have the option of playing on console, but that they have to pay to play on a cab, and leave disappointed.

It's all it takes to ruin the game room for us.

[Shiroikaze]

Okay, quick question here...and I kind of fear the can of worms I'm going to be opening by asking this, but...

You say that the agreement with Nickel City states that there can be no console versions of the games that are brought in, right? This makes complete sense. What is less clear to me, however, is whether that statement covers other games in the same SERIES as the game that was brought in... for example:

Guilty Gear Slash is being provided. Could players bring in the following instead?:
- Guilty Gear XX
- Guilty Gear XX #Reload
- Guilty Gear Isuka (four players)!

Tekken 5 is being provided. What about:
- Tekken 4
- Tekken Tag Tournament

DDR Extreme
-Any JP or US DDR Mix that isn't JP DDR Extreme

I know some of these are more similar than others to the games on the list. If the contract includes a blanket statement about games in the same series, I'd say it's about time to start looking for a new provider. There is something to be said for playing the games in an arcade cabinet, and is sometimes even PREFERRED for tournament play...and I could see why Nickel City wouldn't want 5 TV's with EXACT versions of the games they brought in being available for free. Games in the same series sould be fair game in my opinion, and a blanket statement barring that is a stranglehold on the gaming room and provides very limited capabilities for gamers to practice for the tournaments and try out some of the less common games. I'll put a few quarters into GG: Slash because I've never seen it before...even though I'll have my console versions of XX and Isuka with me as well... Thoughts on this?

[DaviKaze]

It's a nice thought, Shiroikaze, but no fighting gamer gives any amount of crap about playing previous installments in the series. Competition is always about the most recent game.

And wanting to try Slash is another point. Slash and T5.1 are both versions of the game that players aren't really used to playing (Slash is an exception to the players who have already imported it, and even then it's a new game). Nobody's going to want to pay money to take time to learn how to play the games.

Particularly when they should've just been available in the game room on console for free to begin with.

[Rob]

While there's only a few people here on the forums I believe they represent the views of the fighting game community well enough. Perhaps it'd be possible to renegotiate with Nickel City to allow the use of, at least, the console versions of the more popular fighting games. (You could always turn a blind eye, as well.)

Wishful thinking doesn't go very far around here, does it?

As easy as it seems, I'm sure it's unrealistic to the gameroom staff for one reason or another. (Which may be legit, I'm not trying to say otherwise.) As an alternative I, personally, would be satisfied with hearing the reasoning for bringing in fighting game cabs; as opposed to allowing the use of console versions. Maybe that last request is a little more realistic.

[june.h]

OK, I can see a lot of people's points on most of the issues here, mainly with Tekken and GG. But here's the thing.

Tekken 5.1, I can kind of understand, since it's harder to practice since most places don't really have 5.1, and most players rather stick with either DR or console, no gray area. But you can't use a pad argument there.

Other arcades like Slash and MvC2 what's the big deal? Sure, you don't have the option of using pads, but here's the caveat.

Gamers complain that arcades are dying, and no one's really releasing serious fighting games because they're all straight to consoles.

Gamers complain that arcades need to buy the latest arcade games, which are pretty damn expensive (despite what you may think, money doesn't grow on trees for arcades).

Then when an arcade gets the latest game, people will play it for a few weeks, it'll die down. Then once the console version comes out, instead of players practicing at home so they can pit their skills against other players in the arcade, they'll just have console tourneys.

That not only kills arcade business, but it kills the faith of the arcade owners/managers who buy these games for players who don't give a crap, or who do only at their own convenience. Then when the next big game comes out, they promise the same thing again: "OH you NEED to get this game, we'll be there EVERY DAY to play it!" And again, when the console version comes out, the crowds stop coming, and they say the same thing: eff that place, I'll stay home and save money.

C'mon, can't you support the arcade industry even once in a while? That's all I'm talking about anyway.

Quote

Nobody's going to want to pay money to take time to learn how to play the games.

Yeah people don't want to spend money, but how do you think fighters in the mid-to-late 90's survived? People went to arcades, got some of their pocket change, spent money to practice, and learned by getting their butts kicked by anonymous players (Lord knows I was one of those since SF2:WW, I can't even count how much money I spent just to learn how to do basic Ryu moves and learn the game physics). Even when console versions came out, people still came out and played, granted they weren't arcade perfect. But now everyone would rather stay home and play...which isn't a problem until they start whining that arcades are dying and wonder why, and why no one gets the latest fighters.

I know in this day in age, none of this make sense to most fighting gamers anyway.


Now, the issue of paying to play at a con?

Other cons DO bring in arcade games and they do charge to play (I've seen some machines asking for 50%-100% more than what Nickel is asking for). What's worse for those cons, they HAVE to pay to bring those machines in there.

Nickel City is DONATING their machines to ACen. This is already a HELL of a gracious thing that they're doing for the con. The only price he's asking for instead of having ACen pay out of their pockets is that he can leave the games at pay-to-play.


Best thing that can be done at this point, either talk to the Nickel City owner, or just wait for next year. Your concerns should definitely be taken up at the "feedback session" at the end of the con and at the Suggestions forum, and make sure this is a much much bigger issue next year (if need be, bring in others, because not everyone from forums like TZ and SRK read here).


Shiroikaze: I think you need to re-evaluate your suggestions.

Guilty Gear XX
(yay for broken characters!)

Guilty Gear XX #Reload
(why not just play Slash?)

Guilty Gear Isuka (four players)!
(pffft...need I say more?)

Tekken 4
(considering...no one takes this game seriously?)

Tekken Tag Tournament
(too old, but wouldn't be a horrible alternative)

Any JP or US DDR Mix that isn't JP DDR Extreme
(US DDR arcade game have two options: DDR 1.5 aka IRV, and DDR USA, which is utter garbage. DDR Extreme offers the most songs. Plus we did try using various older JP Mixes last year, and people only complained or preferred to play Extreme instead)

[zaps00]

Ok, here we go with some answers...

digimonemporer and Shiroikaze -

The deal with Nickel City is that with the arcade games they provide we will not allow ANY form of that game to be on console, except for tournament play. I stand by this rule 100%.

Nickel City is providing us with quite the extensive list of games this year, and guess what? They actually LOSE money in doing this. The least I can do is ensure that these games have every chance to earn during the convention.

Quote

I know some of these are more similar than others to the games on the list. If the contract includes a blanket statement about games in the same series, I'd say it's about time to start looking for a new provider.

If you can give me the number of a provider with the diversity of games, who is willing to take their top earning games out of a store for 4 of their busiest days of the week, and above all do this at no cost to the convention.... let me know. But I can pretty much tell you from being involved on the management side of the arcade industry for many years, it is not going to happen.

Rob -

The reason we are bringing in the arcade fighting games is because the majority of the attendees actually LIKED this. Sure there may have been a complaint here and there, and you may see a lot of them located here on the forums. What you need to remember is that the complaints we get on the forums here represent a VERY minimal number of the attendees.

So do I please the few, or please the masses? I please the masses.

Console versions WILL be used for the tournaments, but that is it.


We are not FORCING you to play the arcade games. Feel free to go play them in your rooms on your consoles if you want to practice, I have no jurisdiction over what you do in your own room. I do however have jurisdiction over the game room, and the rules we have set in place are to ensure a good business relationship with Nickel City, and in turn that relationship allows up to provide you with the arcade lineup that we could possibly bring to you.

[DaviKaze]

BakaOrochi -

I guess I just fail to see how or why I should care about arcades. I mean, no offense, but I live in Michigan. Arcades aren't exactly on and popping here. When I head out to one I go to play dance/rhythm games and shooters (which aCen has always done well).

I go home to play fighters. GG, in the states, is hardly a game that owes success to arcade release.

The point of this discussion is in fact that Zaps does think he's pleasing the masses. Well, last I checked pleasing the masses is defined by making the largest number of people that you can content.

So if you're pleasing the masses why don't you let every single player come in, plug in, and play for free? You can tell me you're pleasing the masses, but you're not. You're making a select few happy.

Two years ago at Ohayocon GG#R was running on two televisions and the line was close to ten on both set-ups. I've never seen that many people line up to play GG at aCen, regardless of the fact that it's significantly larger in size. The most I've ever seen wanting to play GG at aCen was probably around six, and if I recall correctly they were the Team Serious crew.

Zaps -

I really do respect all the effort you put into the game room. I know it, much like pimping, is not easy. Honestly, you run a great room outside of fighters. You're right - you're not forcing us to play the cabs, but it's the only option we've got in the game room. I, personally, have some of my best times at cons sitting around and playing friednlies during what's normally downtime for a couple of hours. Evidently I'm not the only person upset by the idea of that just being gone.

Saying that you please the masses though - if I honestly thought that a majority of the people who want to play GG at aCen want to do it on a cab I wouldn't be complaining. If you really think this is the case then just do something to verify it. Talk to GGers. Leave a survey at the machine asking players if they'd like to see GG friendlies on console next year.

Basically, the kids I know, scrubs would never touch the cab. Money + stick? Not happening. GG isn't a game like MvC2 in which most good players use a stick either, but all I've ever heard about cabs from guys who play sticks is that the sticks on cabs are crappy, or at least that they'd rather be playing their own stick.

And finally an inconsistency - if more players prefer playing on an arcade cab then why in the world are you running the tournaments on consoles? I always figured it was because a lot of people play on pads and wouldn't want to enter a tournament on a cab. Come to think of it I can recall a number of kids rushing to enter the GG tournament after people found out it was on console last year.

[Syxx]

Well like I said before arcade versions of Initial D, and Para Para, and DDR are great to have for the game room, and people would rather shell out the money to play those definately.

But I can't really see any fighting game people being happy about being forced to pay and for the reasons explained above. Sure they could go play in someone's room or whatever but the game room is a good central place to meet unknowns and out-of-staters. Several are coming that play tekken which is why I'm really disappointed. They've also stated that this will be the last year coming to the convention because of this. Believe it or not, many people come to this convention planning on playing games 90% of the time and to meet new people who play the same games that they do. But it's aggravating that we are forced with a machine with "dead" version which no one has any interest in playing, much less spending money on. I know you're trying to make the game room great, and I thought it was pretty fun last year, but having a lot of those extra arcade versions of the games just makes things more inconvienient for a lot of people.

[june.h]

Syxx: You're just bitter because there's no DR.
=)

I kid I kid, you should have been at GW a few days ago. There was a line at T5, and you know it's bad when I get a win streak going (and these particular guys were talking maaaaaad shi+, especially if their opponents used female characters, and thus bashing my Asuka).

I mean c'mon, when the hell do I ever get more than 1 win at an arcade?!?

XD

[Syxx]

Ya it sucks there's no dr but some people were coming out from iowa that I wanna play.

Oh ya...

GGs hehehe

[WickedElement]

Just so the console players out there know, there are plenty of other fighters out there that will probably be available at the convention in either the console room or a hotel room. I'm sure somebody out there will take the time to bring their own games to share with congoers. Games that can be brought to the console room with no prob are: Capcom Vs SNK 2, Street Fighter III Third Strike, Super Street Fighter II Turbo(only if the ultracade doesn't have SF II on it), King of Fighters series, Samurai Shodown Tenkakuden, Neo Geo Battle Coliseum, Rumble Fish, Soul Calibur series, Garou: Mark of the wolves, and Last Blade series. If you happen to have a US or Jap PS2 or US xbox, you can easily acquire any of these games. Anyway if any of you want some good friendly comp from a So. Cal player on Third Strike, SSFII Turbo, KOF, SS Tenka, NGBC, Tekken, or Soul Calibur, I'll be around the con with an exhibitors badge that says Rising Sun Anime. Just hit me up if you see me in the arcade/console room or even at a room party.

[Syxx]

well that makes me feel better

[Shiroikaze]

I can see things from both sides. Personally, I would prefer a much more open environment where console gaming is less restricted, however, I can also see how an arcade owner would most certainly need to be compensated for pulling out some of his most popular machines for an entire weekend.

What I don't understand is why can't we just leave games like Guilty Gear and Tekken to console play entirely and just borrow DDR, Initial D, PIU, Para Para, etc. from Nickel City? Did all the machines come as a packaged deal?

Regardless, I'm sure there will be quite a few room parties with the more popular fighting games available for free (mine included). BakaOrochi - I'm aware the games I mentioned aren't suited for tournament play and wouldn't be taken seriously. But free Guilty Gear Isuka, XX, or #Reload would have been better than no free Guilty Gear at all...and I know I talked to a few people last year about playing Isuka - even though we all realize how obnoxious it is, since it probably could be a lot of fun with four people who all know what they're doing. Same goes for Tekken Tag Tournament.

In any case, it is kind of a shame, but I'm sure there will be plenty of gaming goodness (and a 20-person-long Gekitou Ninja Taisen!! 4 line) at the ACEN gaming room. Thanks for all your efforts guys, I know you can't please everyone.